From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V8 #68 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Thursday, October 10 2002 Volume 08 : Number 068 ======================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with unsubscribe scribes-digets in the body of the message. Leave the subject line blank. Do not include any additional text. Re: [scribes]: Re: Gesso question [scribes]: Illuminations exemplars of baskets needed [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! RE: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! Re: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! RE: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! [scribes]: Re: scribes digest V8 #67 Re: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! [scribes]: Thank you for all your advice Re: [scribes]: Thank you for all your advice Re: [scribes]: Thank you for all your advice Re: [scribes]: Virus alert - bugbear??? Fwd: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! [scribes]: Walnut Ink Re: [scribes]: Walnut Ink Re: [scribes]: Walnut Ink [scribes]: Gold [scribes]: Re: Walnut Ink Re: [scribes]: Re: Walnut Ink [scribes]: Roll of arms link Ed IV ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 22:51:22 +0200 From: merlyn@virulent.de Subject: Re: [scribes]: Re: Gesso question thanks to all who answered my question and I apologise that it was boring and done before. - now I have to figure out what everything is called in German ( the really fun part) and find what I need here. again my thanks to you all cheers bridget - --- "Trust in God, but tie up your camel." --Indian proverb =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 16:58:51 -0400 From: "K. Z." Subject: [scribes]: Illuminations exemplars of baskets needed Greetings, I have been pouring over books and the internet for pictures of baskets. I am currently looking for market/gathering type baskets that people carried over their arms. Any pictures within our (SCS) time frame. I am asking for books and authors. I was told of a book called "A Woman's Book of Days" that has lots of pictures but can not find it. I know the members of this group pour over books and internet looking for exemplars for their fine illuminations. I am new at this art form and need all the help I can get. I am currently making some new white oak baskets and need exemplars for this purpose. ANY help pointing me in a good direction would be wonderful. I am trying to make all my baskets as close to period as possible. Thank you for any assistance in this matter. Best wishes, Collys Bythesea Kingdom of AEthelmearc Frequent traveler of the ports of Trimaris Only a Pirates life for me. Mutiny is only a difference in opinions. Terra Marique Potens (Powerful by land and sea). Vive la mort, vive la guerre, vive le sacre mercenaire" ("Long live death, long live war, long live the cursed mercenary") -- Mercenary marching cadence and toast. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- _________________________________________________________________ Chat with friends online, try MSN Messenger: http://messenger.msn.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 22:57:37 -0400 From: Marina Subject: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! I need some encouragement. I know I can count on you guys. I have been working on a scroll for the past 3 months. It is a wedding invitation, with Gothic script, and period illumination. I have re-done this scroll, now almost 5 times. I say almost 5 because, I have to start on it fresh again tomorrow evening, and I am very unhappy about it. My calligraphy sucks way bad, but my illumination is great. My question, do you think that I can accomplish the scroll by Saturday afternoon? Yeah, the wedding is Saturday, and I wanted it to be their gift. The mistakes that I have been making are not fixable, otherwise I wouldn't fret so. My Lord Husband says to make one as a promissory, and tell them that the real one will be shipped to them. Opinions? Marina of Starhaven =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 22:13:23 -0500 From: "Helen Schultz" Subject: RE: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! Marina: You are rather between a rock and a hard place, aren't you?? I feel for you, really. If you don't have a calligrapher who lives "really" close to you who could do the calligraphy for you, do you have a light box?? Try making several Xerox copies of the type of script you want and then trace them onto your scroll. In other words, using a cartridge pen, and the light box, trace each letter you need from the pages you Xeroxed. This is not the most optimum way to do a final piece, but since you are in a real pinch, it is probably the best I can suggest... other than the one your good husband suggested. Then, later, use the same technique but with tracing paper over your Xeroxed sheets and teach yourself that hand!! You never know when it might come in handy again. And, do your calligraphy first... it is always less traumatic to have to pitch just calligraphy than it is to have to pitch your completed illumination... think about that really well in the future. This is why those of us who do both calligraphy and illumination usually stress that order of work. Rule of Thumb: Calligraphy first, draw in your illumination, do any gilding, then paint in your illumination. Also, sometimes we are our worst critics... ask your husband if the calligraphy *really* sucks, or if it is just your own perception of it. Try working slower, too, that sometimes helps. Take a great big, long refreshing breath, put on some rather soothing music, and try not to rush. I often do much the same as you... get really frustrated when things don't go the way I think they should. Thank goodness, I live alone with 3 cats... they keep far away from me when I am in that mood... as I yell at them and myself in frustration. That sometimes helps a little, but getting away from the piece for a little while helps, too. I know you can't do that for long at this stage of your project, but see if it helps just a little to redirect your focus. Good luck, and let us know how the end result turns out Meisterin Katarina Helene von Schönborn, OL Shire of Narrental (Peru, Indiana) Middle Kingdom http://meisterin.katarina.home.insightbb.com {Some mistakes are too much fun to make only once.} - -----Original Message----- Marina said: I need some encouragement. I know I can count on you guys. I have been working on a scroll for the past 3 months. It is a wedding invitation, with Gothic script, and period illumination. I have re-done this scroll, now almost 5 times. I say almost 5 because, I have to start on it fresh again tomorrow evening, and I am very unhappy about it. My calligraphy sucks way bad, but my illumination is great. My question, do you think that I can accomplish the scroll by Saturday afternoon? Yeah, the wedding is Saturday, and I wanted it to be their gift. The mistakes that I have been making are not fixable, otherwise I wouldn't fret so. My Lord Husband says to make one as a promissory, and tell them that the real one will be shipped to them. Opinions? Marina of Starhaven =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 23:33:49 EDT From: KMcWhyte@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! - --part1_73.2731b1f1.2ad4fd9d_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/8/02 10:56:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time, marina@greyhawkes.com writes: > I need some encouragement. I know I can count on you guys. I have been > working on a scroll for the past 3 months. It is a wedding invitation, > with Gothic script, and period illumination. I have re-done this scroll, > now almost 5 times. I say almost 5 because, I have to start on it fresh > again tomorrow evening, and I am very unhappy about it. > My calligraphy sucks way bad, but my illumination is great. > My question, do you think that I can accomplish the scroll by Saturday > afternoon? Yeah, the wedding is Saturday, and I wanted it to be their gift. > The mistakes that I have been making are not fixable, otherwise I wouldn't > fret so. My Lord Husband says to make one as a promissory, and tell them > that the real one will be shipped to them. > Opinions? > > Marina of Starhaven > > > This is the part where I remind myself that I am coming down with bronchitis, probably partially as a result of staying up late to pen 9 small scrolls in 6 days recently to help someone else out. Not that I didn't enjoy it (I had lots of fun with it) - it started as 5, then I opened my big mouth and asked for more.... My hand fell off on scroll no. 9. But I really have this urge to help.... Considering I'm probably nowhere near where you are to offer any hands-on assistance, and Meistern Katarina had some REALLY good advice just then, I guess the only thing I have to offer is a bunch of fonts that look VERY close to period calligraphy, which could, as your husband suggested, be used for a promissory. Or it could be traced..... I have fonts that resemble bastarde, and fraktur, as well as more traditional wedding-style scripts. If you think these fonts would be of any use to you, let me know and I'll send copies over. Good luck!! YIS, Lady Kayleigh McWhyte Barony of An Dubhaigheainn, East Kingdom Elizabeth Frank Long Island, NY - --part1_73.2731b1f1.2ad4fd9d_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/8/02 10:56:32 PM Eastern Daylight Time, marina@greyhawkes.com writes:


I need some encouragement.  I know I can count on you guys.  I have been
working on a scroll for the past 3 months.  It is a wedding invitation,
with Gothic script, and period illumination.  I have re-done this scroll,
now almost 5 times.  I say almost 5 because, I have to start on it fresh
again tomorrow evening, and I am very unhappy about it.
My calligraphy sucks way bad, but my illumination is great.
My question, do you think that I can accomplish the scroll by Saturday
afternoon?  Yeah, the wedding is Saturday, and I wanted it to be their gift.
The mistakes that I have been making are not fixable, otherwise I wouldn't
fret so.  My Lord Husband says to make one as a promissory, and tell them
that the real one will be shipped to them.
Opinions?

Marina of Starhaven




This is the part where I remind myself that I am coming down with bronchitis, probably partially as a result of staying up late to pen 9 small scrolls in 6 days recently to help someone else out. Not that I didn't enjoy it (I had lots of fun with it) - it started as 5, then I opened my big mouth and asked for more.... My hand fell off on scroll no. 9.

But I really have this urge to help....

Considering I'm probably nowhere near where you are to offer any hands-on assistance, and Meistern Katarina had some REALLY good advice just then, I guess the only thing I have to offer is a bunch of fonts that look VERY close to period calligraphy, which could, as your husband suggested, be used for a promissory. Or it could be traced.....

I have fonts that resemble bastarde, and fraktur, as well as more traditional wedding-style scripts. If you think these fonts would be of any use to you, let me know and I'll send copies over. Good luck!!

YIS,

Lady Kayleigh McWhyte
Barony of An Dubhaigheainn, East Kingdom

Elizabeth Frank
Long Island, NY - --part1_73.2731b1f1.2ad4fd9d_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 8 Oct 2002 20:55:16 -0700 (PDT) From: Mary Haselbauer Subject: RE: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! Marina: Here a totally off the wall idea. As a wedding present someone framed the invitation with some silk flowers. It was kinda cute. The frame was made for this and is extra deep and had a velvety backing. If you perhaps have one where your calligraphy didn't suck you could cut out the calligraphy and the illumination out of seperate tries and mount them in the frame. I imagine space between the C and I where the fabric shows though. You would need to get some archival double sided mounting tape. It wouldn't really be a SCA type scroll - more of a modern crafty thing. This could of course be not appropriate for your friends or your own vison. Just remember, they are going to love it no matter what you do. (And get the hubby to give you a shoulder rub.) Cheers, Slaine __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos & More http://faith.yahoo.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 22:14:49 -0600 From: Juanita Subject: [scribes]: Re: scribes digest V8 #67 One of the annoying things about period chemistry is that the names of things are quite mutable. Copperas usually is the same thing as melantaria which is the same thing as green vitriol which in modern usage is the same thing as iron sulfate heptahydrate. But term usage was horribly sloppy - and a more basic iron sulfate hydrate like copiapite might have been called copperas/vitriol also. > The question that arises foremost in my mind is; How do > these inks stand up to the test of time? Usually well. > Being of an organic and acidic nature, and noting the > reference to oxidation, are they not inherently unstable > due to decay and chemical change? It depends a lot on the chemical composition of both the ink and the vellum/paper. If you've put too much vitriol in your ink batch, or if you're using a cheap non-pH balance paper, you're doomed. If you're using pH balanced materials, there's little to worry about. > So the question becomes was the ink itself too "strong" for some reason? Too > much iron, maybe? I know that iron is the reason so many vintage silk fabrics, > particularly from the Victorian age, have shattered. The mordants were iron > based (to give the fabric a heavier and more expensive feel) and those terribly > small iron particles have cut the fibers. Interesting - but are you sure is wasn't the sulfate that the iron was bonded to rather than the iron? An iron sulfate mordant doesn't produce sharp little iron pieces. The iron stays in solution in most dyeing recipes until it has the opportunity to precipitate out or bond with something in the fabric/leather/vellum. > Or is there some other factor here? Exposure to light/heat/moisture that may > have either accelerated the corrosive effects of the iron gall ink, or reacted > with it in some manner to produce it's own bad effects??? This isn't really > something they address on the website regarding ink corrosion, so I don't have > the answers. Hot and cold aren't an issue. Light should not be an issue. Air quality is an issue, especially in Europe in places where leaded gasoline is still in use and coal plants can get away with having no scrubbers. Emmisions lead and atmospheric SO2 can corrode anything given enough time... > > Coppras can be used as a substitute for iron with any ink recipe, > > so far as I know. > > "coppras' copperas, et. are old names for ferrous sulphate, which is rusty > iron. also available from dye suppliers as it's used as the iron mordant for > dyeing. NNNNOOOOOOOOooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!! Please don't sub a soluable iron sulfate hydrate for iron in other forms!!! Depending on the recipe, it could really screw up your ink. Rusty iron is usually a combination of various iron oxides and iron oxyhydroxide hydrates - nary a sulfate in sight - and it is not corrosive, whereas any of the iron sulfate hydrates are quite corrosive > > >So the question becomes was the ink itself too "strong" for some > > reason? Too much iron, maybe? > > > >Yes, I have a little book on iron/tannin inks that discusses this--I think > >it's by V.A. Thompson? (I can double-check if anyone's interested.) No - it's not too much iron, but rather, too much sulfate. The identity of the cation is nowhere near as important since too much SO4 leads to the formation of sulfuric acid. > My first batch of slaked plaster was made according to the period > recipe. When I was done, I was glad that I had slaked a whole 10 > pound bag of plaster of paris. I count my blessings that I started off with a 2 pound bag, not a 10 pound one ;-) > Not wanting to repeat the period (long) process... I found a modern > recipe for slaking plaster written by an author who retranslated > Cennini's recipe instead of relying on the translations of others. > Through his new perspective and with a bit of modern chemical > knowledge he developed new recipes for slaked plaster and gesso. would you be referring to the article that was published as part of the Getty Museum conservation science symposium in the late 80's??? (I read it once but haven't been able to find it recently so I could make a copy of it for myself) <> I did a little experimentation a few years back and put the plaster (added slowly and incrementally) in the blender. It takes 2 to 3 hours for the exothermic reaction so stop, so that's how long I ran the blender for. I then compared it to the slaked plaster I made following the #@$%&*! directions in Cennini (never again, never never again...). The Cennini recipe slaked plaster would completely pass through my ASTM "paint standard" 423 mesh sieve, whereas a small amount of the blender slaked paster was retained on the 423 mesh sieve. Most of that remainder would pass a 400 mesh sieve, so it was still pretty damn small... Does it matter? I don't think so - - the particle size distribution of the two gesso batches were so close that the differences are probably negligible. ttfn Therasia - --------- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 08 Oct 2002 22:16:21 -0700 From: Karen Williams Subject: Re: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! If you really hate your calligraphy, get someone else to do it and do the illumination yourself. Granted, it won't be done entirely by you, but it's the thought that counts. Branwen - -- Karen Williams branwen@ix.netcom.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 07:05:22 -0400 From: Marina Subject: [scribes]: Thank you for all your advice And encouragement. My Lord Husband is not a good one to ask, as he knows calligraphy well, and no matter what I do, there is always a little helpful note, meant to assist me in growing my skills, like "you have to remember to keep your lines straighter", "why did you choose this hand over a simpler one?", "I like it but. . . . . here's what you need to do to make it better". I know it's meant to be helpful, but it really feels like I should say to heck with it, and just illuminate. Unfortunately, there isn't anyone near me that can do the calligraphy. Our Shire is new to scribal, and even though we have folks who have their Laurel in the scribal arts, they are not exactly on that friendly of terms with me, and (not tooting my own horn), my calligraphy is by far the best of the newbies to scribe. So you can see my points of frustration. Hey!? Here's a thought I just came up with! Why not have my Husband do the calligraphy, and I'll do the illumination. Hmmmmm! Marina of Starhaven =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 09 Oct 2002 09:26:03 -0700 From: Subject: Re: [scribes]: Thank you for all your advice On Wed, 09 Oct 2002 07:05:22 -0400 Marina wrote: > Why not > have my Husband do the > calligraphy, and I'll do the illumination. > Hmmmmm! Funny, I was just thinking that. :-) And it would be a gift from both of you. Branwen ferch Emrys =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 09:52:43 +0800 From: Jean-Paul Blaquiere Subject: Re: [scribes]: Thank you for all your advice > On Oct 09, Marina illuminated : > Unfortunately, there isn't anyone near me that can do the calligraphy. Our > Shire is new to scribal, and even though we have folks who have their > Laurel in the scribal arts, they are not exactly on that friendly of terms > with me, and (not tooting my own horn), my calligraphy is by far the best > of the newbies to scribe. So you can see my points of frustration. Hey!? > Here's a thought I just came up with! Why not have my Husband do the > calligraphy, and I'll do the illumination. Hmmmmm! > With all the encouragement he seems to be giving you, good idea!!!!! I have found with all technique based pastimes (C&I, archery, rapier, tournament fighting, yida yida) that you give hints and help to people appropriate to their current level of ability. ie, newbies, lots and lots so they don't get bad habits, less as they get more ability and a definate change to discussion about why we do things certain ways when we become good/brilliant. We never stop learning but there are ways in which we can help others learn that enhances how they learn, rather than hinder. ./jehan, stopping the hinting now - -- Jean-Paul Blaquiere || Avatar of Computational japester@ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au || Thaumaturgy http://japester.ucc.asn.au || verum ipsum factum Questions are dangerous, for they have answers =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 22:53:16 EDT From: ArtsofPalm@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Virus alert - bugbear??? hmm.. sounds like D&D... How did you find out you had it and how can I check to see if I have it? If it shuts down virus protection software, how would Symantec help??? Sorry for my confusion. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 23:15:22 EDT From: ArtsofPalm@aol.com Subject: Fwd: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! - --part1_c1.286af622.2ad64aca_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/9/2002 11:14:38 PM Eastern Daylight Time, ArtsofPalm writes: << Hi, Marina... This is why I think the question about pasting into a scroll is so good. If your illumination is bad, perhaps you can give the scroll to them, sans the actual calligraphy (or with a printed version of what the calligraphy will say when you get it right)... then you can practice on a separate piece of paper until you get it right... if you have artwork finished you could paste right over the top of the calligraphy that you don't like or onto the blank space. Meanwhile, they keep their scroll. You might even think about 'trading' your artwork for someone else's calligraphy (you can see that I'm grappling with the EXACT same problem here....) >> - --part1_c1.286af622.2ad64aca_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: From: ArtsofPalm@aol.com Full-name: ArtsofPalm Message-ID: <112.18e56f4c.2ad64a9e@aol.com> Date: Wed, 9 Oct 2002 23:14:38 EDT Subject: Re: [scribes]: I am so frustrated!!!!! To: marina@greyhawkes.com MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 108 Hi, Marina... This is why I think the question about pasting into a scroll is so good. If your illumination is bad, perhaps you can give the scroll to them, sans the actual calligraphy (or with a printed version of what the calligraphy will say when you get it right)... then you can practice on a separate piece of paper until you get it right... if you have artwork finished you could paste right over the top of the calligraphy that you don't like or onto the blank space. Meanwhile, they keep their scroll. You might even think about 'trading' your artwork for someone else's calligraphy (you can see that I'm grappling with the EXACT same problem here....) - --part1_c1.286af622.2ad64aca_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 09:50:09 -0400 From: KMcWhyte@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Walnut Ink I know we've discussed this one before, but I figured as a neat fall project for the local herbalist guild and scribe guild, we might get together over here next month and work on making walnut ink together, using black walnuts from friends' yards. Anyone have the recipe for this? Lady Kayleigh McWhyte Barony of An Dubhaigheainn, East Drake University for Courtly Kingdom Scribes (aka D.U.C.K.S.... or 'Duck U.') *grin* Beth Frank Long Island, NY =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 09:03:35 -0500 From: "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Walnut Ink At 09:50 AM 10/10/2002 -0400, KMcWhyte@aol.com wrote: >I know we've discussed this one before, but I figured as a neat fall >project for the local herbalist guild and scribe guild, we might get >together over here next month and work on making walnut ink together, >using black walnuts from friends' yards. > >Anyone have the recipe for this? I don't understand why everyone's talking about ink right now, but they seem to be. *grin* take the walnuts - you really want just the blackened husks, but you can put the whole thing in the pot, it's no biggie - just cover with water. simmer. For hours or days - your choice. For darker ink, add some nails or simmer the ink in a cast iron pan/pot. take off of the heat, allow to cool. strain. - you've got ink. Things you can add if you want - salt, vinegar, gum. Salt and vinegar will slow down any mold that will want to grow in it. Gum makes some people more secure that the ink will stay on the paper. None of the three are required. Second method: Put husks/walnuts in pot in the back yard, covered with water. Again, you can do this in a cast iron pot or add nails to darken the ink more but it's not required. Cover the pot and leave it alone for about a month - at least a couple of weeks. Be sure all the water doesn't evaporate, add more if necessary. Scrape off any mold that may have formed. Strain. You've got ink. See above for additives. Hope this helps. Smiles, Despina de la teaching a class on inks in a couple of weeks =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:13:57 -0400 From: KMcWhyte@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Walnut Ink Thanks, Bess & Despina! *hugs* - --Kayleigh de la doing-too-much ;) =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 09:13:27 -0500 From: "Vicki Crouse" Subject: [scribes]: Gold This is a MIME message. If you are reading this text, you may want to consider changing to a mail reader or gateway that understands how to properly handle MIME multipart messages. - --=_7D21E806.A7C6A06F Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Could some one tell me the best kind of 'liquid gold' or gold flake paint = to use? Some times I want to do just a bit of shine after the fact and = haven't found one I'm real happy with yet. Any suggestions on gold leafing = would be welcome too. Humbly Victoria La Russa Crescent Moon - --=_7D21E806.A7C6A06F Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Content-Description: HTML
Could some one tell me the best kind of 'liquid gold' or gold flake = paint=20 to use? Some times I want to do just a bit of shine after the fact and = haven't=20 found one I'm real happy with yet. Any suggestions on gold leafing would = be=20 welcome too.
 
Humbly
Victoria La Russa
Crescent Moon
- --=_7D21E806.A7C6A06F-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 10:36:15 EDT From: RenScribe@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Re: Walnut Ink - --part1_102.1c405a61.2ad6ea5f_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I took a class at Weekend of Wisdom a couple of years ago taught by Lady Alienor Russeal. She made several different inks and let us play with each of them. :-) I really liked the walnut. At the end of the class, she offered walnuts to anyone who wanted to take them home and give it a try. So when I got home ... What I did was fill an enamel pot that I only use for making scribal supplies to within about 2 inches of the top with walnuts. I put in enough distilled water to cover them and let them cook on low heat for about an hour and a half. My kids complained the whole time because it was quite smelly. I used a slotted spoon and got out as many of the larger pieces of the walnuts as I could and tested the color on a piece of paper. It looked a bit weak, so I put it back on the heat until more of the water evaporated. After I was satisfied with the color, I strained it through a double thickness of old pantyhose and mixed in a bit of powdered gum arabic. I split it up into 2 different jars. One was left as is and made a nice dark brown ink. I wired together a couple of rusty screws and placed them in the second jar (the wire I bent over the lip of the jar so I could retrieve the screws easily) After a day or so, the ink turned much darker ... It was black, but not a deep, rich black. A little lampblack added to the ink gave it an immediate boost. Enjoy :-) Yvianne AEthelmearc - --part1_102.1c405a61.2ad6ea5f_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I took a class at Weekend of Wisdom a couple of years ago taught by Lady Alienor Russeal. She made several different inks and let us play with each of them. :-) I really liked the walnut. At the end of the class, she offered walnuts to anyone who wanted to take them home and give it a try. So when I got home ...

What I did was fill an enamel pot that I only use for making scribal supplies to within about 2 inches of the top with walnuts. I put in enough distilled water to cover them and let them cook on low heat for about an hour and a half. My kids complained the whole time because it was quite smelly.

I used a slotted spoon and got out as many of the larger pieces of the walnuts as I could and tested the color on a piece of paper. It looked a bit weak, so I put it back on the heat until more of the water evaporated. After I was satisfied with the color, I strained it through a double thickness of old pantyhose and mixed in a bit of powdered gum arabic. I split it up into 2 different jars. One was left as is and made a nice dark brown ink. I wired together a couple of rusty screws and placed them in the second jar (the wire I bent over the lip of the jar so I could retrieve the screws easily) After a day or so, the ink turned much darker ... It was black, but not a deep, rich black. A little lampblack added to the ink gave it an immediate boost.

Enjoy  :-)

Yvianne
AEthelmearc - --part1_102.1c405a61.2ad6ea5f_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 11:32:15 -0200 From: alienor Subject: Re: [scribes]: Re: Walnut Ink Just a couple of additions to the posts: I have discovered that the walnut ink without the iron sulfate is fairly water soluble, especially on pergamenta. While that's great for correction purposes, it does mean exercising a lot of caution. :~) When we had this discussion a few years ago, I had an email from Jack Thompson mentioned earlier as the author of Manuscript Inks. He has been on this list in the past, by the way, though I'm not sure he's still subscribed. Anyway, he suggested putting a very small amount of copperas into ink even though you want it to remain brown. He says that this helps make it less water soluble. I still have ink from my first batch. It's well over two years old and has never had a trace of mold that I could see. It's quite a lovely black since I started out with about a quart of water which was boiled down to the amount of ink which would fit in a Higgins Black Magic bottle. I still have all those nut trees. I live in Central Pa and have friends who attend East Kingdom Events regularly, while I show up in AEthelmearc. If anyone wants a bag of black walnuts and happens to be attending Kingdoms Crusades-- and you let me know by this afternoon--off the list, I could see that the walnuts get to the events. This is just a cheap ploy to clean up my yard. :~) I will be at Weekend of Wisdom on Saturday and at Heralds and Scribes and AEthelmearc Academy and can take nuts to those events. Cheers, Alienor ---- I may be odd, but I really LIKE the smell of cooking walnuts-- and they clean all the scum out of your pots. Which reminds me...if you want to keep the ink brown, it's best to cook it in an enamel pot. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 10 Oct 2002 14:06:19 -0400 From: Randy Asplund Subject: [scribes]: Roll of arms link Ed IV Hi gang, This is one of those days when I really wish I had DSL!!! Here is a manuscript Roll of Arms of the genealogy of Edward IV. I am not responsible for any suicides that may come from viewing the link. http://libwww.library.phila.gov/medieval/lewis_e201/index.html RanthulfR (Who's walnut ink DID mold!) - -- VISIT RandyAsplund.com To see a Universe of art ranging from Magic: The Gathering to Star Trek and Medieval Manuscripts: Original Art & Prints for sale! Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V8 #68 ****************************