From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V8 #66 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Monday, October 7 2002 Volume 08 : Number 066 ======================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with unsubscribe scribes-digets in the body of the message. Leave the subject line blank. Do not include any additional text. Re: [scribes]: oak galls Re: [scribes]: oak galls Re: [scribes]: oak galls Re: [scribes]: oak galls Re: [scribes]: oak galls Fwd: Re: [scribes]: oak galls [scribes]: Oak galls near Pittsburgh Re: [scribes]: oak galls Re: [scribes]: oak galls [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings Re: [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings RE: [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings Re: [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings [scribes]: demo [scribes]: Gall inks Re: [scribes]: oak galls Re: [scribes]: Gall inks ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 12:52:29 -0400 From: "Vesta MoonShadow" Subject: Re: [scribes]: oak galls I went hunting oak galls this weekend after lurking on this list for a while now wondering where to start. I'm very excited to say that I (we, a friend went with) found a rather large handful. Now.. questions.. what do I do now? : ) Complete newbie to scribing.. Vesta =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 12:54:57 EDT From: Floriligeum@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: oak galls - --part1_24.2c8f4c38.2ad31661_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is that what those things are? I have not been paying very close attention to this thread as I did not think I had access to any galls. I had heard they were always on the branches or trunks. My mother's house has a huge pin oak tree that is usually infested with galls on the leaves. I am sure she will love me having an excuse to come up bring the kids for a visit. Not to mention us helping to deal with the massive quantity of leaves she will have to rake starting in a few weeks. This tree seems to hold up to 50% of its leaves until spring when the new leaves force the old ones off. Should I wait until the weather is colder before harvesting the galls? Will this help insure that the inhabitants have left? For the first time I am actually thinking about making my own ink! Thanks for the inspiration. Yours in service, Sarra the Lymner Caer Adamant (DE), East Kingdom MKA Sarah Dressler Sarra's Florilegium www.sarrasflorilegium.knownworldweb.com They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Dost thou love life? Then do not squander time, for that is the stuff life is made of. There never was a good war or a bad peace. Benjamin Franklin 1706 - 1790 "To repeat what others have said, requires education; to challenge it, requires brains." Mary Pettibone Poole, A Glass Eye at a Keyhole, 1938 - --part1_24.2c8f4c38.2ad31661_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Is that what those things are?

I have not been paying very close attention to this thread as I did not think I had access to any galls.  I had heard they were always on the branches or trunks.  My mother's house has a huge pin oak tree that is usually infested with galls on the leaves.  

I am sure she will love me having an excuse to come up bring the kids for a visit.  Not to mention us helping to deal with the massive quantity of leaves she will have to rake starting in a few weeks.  This tree seems to hold up to 50% of its leaves until spring when the new leaves force the old ones off.

Should I wait until the weather is colder before harvesting the galls?  Will this help insure that the inhabitants have left?

For the first time I am actually thinking about making my own ink!  Thanks for the inspiration.

Yours in service,

Sarra the Lymner

Caer Adamant (DE), East Kingdom
MKA Sarah Dressler
Sarra's Florilegium
www.sarrasflorilegium.knownworldweb.com

       They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
       Dost thou love life? Then do not squander time, for that is the stuff life is made of.
       There never was a good war or a bad peace.                        Benjamin Franklin 1706 - 1790
"To repeat what others have said, requires education; to challenge it, requires brains."
                                                                      Mary Pettibone Poole, A Glass Eye at a Keyhole, 1938 - --part1_24.2c8f4c38.2ad31661_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 09:45:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Karen Kasper Subject: Re: [scribes]: oak galls - --0-1100366564-1034009106=:31317 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Thanks! That was very helpful. I've only seen oak galls that look likes the ones in pictures 1 and 2 (in classes, though not on actual trees) so I don't think I would have recognized the ones in the third picture as galls in the wild. Can you use the ones that look like that last picture for making ink? They almost look "immature" in the sense that maybe the bugs are still in them (ick) and the tannin hasn't really settled (or whatever it does). :-) Arianna "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" wrote:At 01:06 PM 10/2/2002 -0700, you wrote: >So where does one find galls? > >So do the galls tend to appear on particular kinds of oak trees, at >particular times of year? Do they often fall off the trees? Or is it >likely that Pittsburgh doesn't have the right kind of bugs or weather or >whatever? Oak galls can be found on the trunk of the tree, on the ends of the branches or on the leaves themselves. They are more frequently seen in the latter portion of the year, August through December (when you can still find leaves on trees in December in the oak's range). Pittsburgh does have the right insects and trees for oak galls, I've picked them out of trees near Pennsic and Philly so I'm pretty sure that Pittsburgh would have them too. They come in many sizes and are placed in many different areas of the tree. Here are some pictoral examples: http://www.bugsinthenews.com/Fern_Bluff_Park_021001_Oak_Galls.gif http://fhpr8.srs.fs.fed.us/pubs/oakpests/images/insects/applegall41.jpg http://www.ipm.uiuc.edu/publications/infosheets/71-plantgalls/galls9big.jpg The last picture is what I see more of, the other two pictures are more easily spotted. Hope this helps. Smiles, Despina =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. Karen Kasper "Good teaching is one-fourth preparation and three-fourths theater." Gail Godwin "To repeat what others have said, requires education; to challenge it, requires brains." Mary Pettibone Poole, A Glass Eye at a Keyhole, 1938 - --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos, & more faith.yahoo.com - --0-1100366564-1034009106=:31317 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Thanks!  That was very helpful.  I've only seen oak galls that look likes the ones in pictures 1 and 2 (in classes, though not on actual trees) so I don't think I would have recognized the ones in the third picture as galls in the wild.  Can you use the ones that look like that last picture for making ink?  They almost look "immature" in the sense that maybe the bugs are still in them (ick) and the tannin hasn't really settled (or whatever it does).  :-)

Arianna

 "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" wrote:

At 01:06 PM 10/2/2002 -0700, you wrote:

>So where does one find galls?
>
>So do the galls tend to appear on particular kinds of oak trees, at
>particular times of year? Do they often fall off the trees? Or is it
>likely that Pittsburgh doesn't have the right kind of bugs or weather or
>whatever?

Oak galls can be found on the trunk of the tree, on the ends of the
branches or on the leaves themselves. They are more frequently seen in the
latter portion of the year, August through December (when you can still
find leaves on trees in December in the oak's range).

Pittsburgh does have the right insects and trees for oak galls, I've picked
them out of trees near Pennsic and Philly so I'm pretty sure that
Pittsburgh would have them too.

They come in many sizes and are placed in many different areas of the
tree. Here are some pictoral examples:
http://www.bugsinthenews.com/Fern_Bluff_Park_021001_Oak_Galls.gif

http://fhpr8.srs.fs.fed.us/pubs/oakpests/images/insects/applegall41.jpg

http://www.ipm.uiuc.edu/publications/infosheets/71-plantgalls/galls9big.jpg

The last picture is what I see more of, the other two pictures are more
easily spotted.

Hope this helps.

Smiles,
Despina


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Karen Kasper

"Good teaching is one-fourth preparation and three-fourths theater." Gail Godwin

"To repeat what others have said, requires education; to challenge it, requires brains."
Mary Pettibone Poole, A Glass Eye at a Keyhole, 1938


Do you Yahoo!?
Faith Hill - Exclusive Performances, Videos, & more
faith.yahoo.com - --0-1100366564-1034009106=:31317-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 12:04:12 -0500 From: "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" Subject: Re: [scribes]: oak galls At 12:54 PM 10/7/2002 -0400, Floriligeum@aol.com wrote: >Is that what those things are? Yup. >Should I wait until the weather is colder before harvesting the >galls? Will this help insure that the inhabitants have left? You don't have to. If you harvest the leaves with the galls on them, you should put them into a tight container - such as a ziplock bag - until the galls turn brown. At that point, you'll be able to see the insects in the baggie, dead. If you get so many that you can't put them into a ziplock or two, then put them into a paper bag and place that in the garage, or back porch area - somewhere that if a few insects hatch every so often, they can get out to the outside. BTW, these insects aren't harmful to people, and they're very small, a bit smaller than the average ant, actually. You just don't want them infesting your house. *grin* When the galls are brown and hard, they're ready to be made into ink. (you can smash them apart with a hammer before plunking them into water in a pot - - kids like the smashing part.) >For the first time I am actually thinking about making my own ink! Thanks >for the inspiration. It's really simple and very easy. I hope you try it. You're welcome. Smiles, Despina - ---------- "I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work." - - Thomas Alva Edison (1847-1931) =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 12:17:29 -0500 From: "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" Subject: Re: [scribes]: oak galls At 12:52 PM 10/7/2002 -0400, you wrote: >I went hunting oak galls this weekend after lurking on this list for a while >now wondering where to start. I'm very excited to say that I (we, a friend >went with) found a rather large handful. Now.. questions.. what do I do now? >: ) If the galls are brown and hard, they are ready to be made into ink. Have a pan that you want to use only for ink making. If it's cast iron or just iron, all the better. Crack the galls open (some types you need to use a hammer) and place them into the pot. Put water in the pot, enough to cover the gall bits. Put in some iron nails. Let this simmer for a few hours. Add water when it needs it - don't let it go dry. After it's been simmering for an hour or so, take it off the heat and let it cool. Strain it through some fine cloth. Add a little gum arabic for binder. Viola, you have ink. The other way to do it is to leave the galls covered in water with nails in the pot and let it sit for a few weeks, occasionally adding water when needed and scraping off any mold that may form. Again, strain it, add a little gum arabic and you have ink! There are also several good websites on making ink if you search in google. Smiles, Despina de la I hope this helps - ---------- "I can accept failure. Everyone fails at something. But I can't accept not trying." - -- Michael Jordan =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 12:13:43 -0500 From: "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" Subject: Fwd: Re: [scribes]: oak galls > > >> Can you use the ones that look like that last picture for making >> ink? They almost look "immature" in the sense that maybe the bugs are >> still in them (ick) and the tannin hasn't really settled (or whatever it >> does). :-) > >Yes, you need to keep those in a ziplock with the leaf until the galls >turn brown. They are then ready to use. The leaf will be brittle enough >to easily extract the gall. The insects will emerge from the gall in the >ziplock but they will suffocate and die in the ziplock. Be sure that >they're dead or you'll have a couple of tiny things flying at you when you >open the ziplock. > >Smiles, >Despina =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 13:29:09 EDT From: RenScribe@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Oak galls near Pittsburgh - --part1_1ba.74e1a24.2ad31e65_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/7/2002 12:00:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, aheilvei@uiuc.edu writes: > Pittsburgh does have the right insects and trees for oak galls, I've picked > them out of trees near Pennsic and Philly so I'm pretty sure that > Pittsburgh would have them too. Try walking down some of the side paths in North Park or along the tree line ... not too far from the swimming pool. Aengus and I found many of the small ones that grow on the leaves and several of the larger dark ones there a couple of years ago. Be prepared to reach for them. The small leaf ones are also found in abundance on the campus of Butler Co. Community College ... where Sunderoak occasionally holds events. Yvianne PS - Despina - Thanks for the links to the images. It would have been so much easier for us if we had actually known what we were looking for before we found them :-) > > They come in many sizes and are placed in many different areas of the > tree. Here are some pictoral examples: > http://www.bugsinthenews.com/Fern_Bluff_Park_021001_Oak_Galls.gif > > http://fhpr8.srs.fs.fed.us/pubs/oakpests/images/insects/applegall41.jpg > > http://www.ipm.uiuc.edu/publications/infosheets/71-plantgalls/galls9big.jpg > > The last picture is what I see more of, the other two pictures are more > easily spotted. > - --part1_1ba.74e1a24.2ad31e65_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 10/7/2002 12:00:19 PM Eastern Daylight Time, aheilvei@uiuc.edu writes:

Pittsburgh does have the right insects and trees for oak galls, I've picked
them out of trees near Pennsic and Philly so I'm pretty sure that
Pittsburgh would have them too.


Try walking down some of the side paths in North Park or along the tree line ... not too far from the swimming pool. Aengus and I found many of the small ones that grow on the leaves and several of the larger dark ones there a couple of years ago. Be prepared to reach for them.

The small leaf ones are also found in abundance on the campus of Butler Co. Community College ... where Sunderoak occasionally holds events.

Yvianne

PS - Despina - Thanks for the links to the images. It would have been so much easier for us if we had actually known what we were looking for before we found them  :-)


They come in many sizes and are placed in many different areas of the
tree.  Here are some pictoral examples:
http://www.bugsinthenews.com/Fern_Bluff_Park_021001_Oak_Galls.gif

http://fhpr8.srs.fs.fed.us/pubs/oakpests/images/insects/applegall41.jpg

http://www.ipm.uiuc.edu/publications/infosheets/71-plantgalls/galls9big.jpg

The last picture is what I see more of, the other two pictures are more
easily spotted.


 - --part1_1ba.74e1a24.2ad31e65_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 10:48:20 -0700 From: Carolyn_Richardson@prosystemfx.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: oak galls You can use Despina's method, or you can also do it the way I learned: Soak the oak galls/pieces in hot water (you're essentially making oak gall tea). Add copprous (which is some type of iron mineral, regardless that it sounds like a copper mineral). Add gum arabic, and you have ink. Actually, the best "gall" ink I ever used wasn't made with oak galls at all - it was made with Lipton tea and copprous, of all things. Tea is also heavy in tannins (Lipton is particularly so - that's what makes it so bitter), which is what you really need for the ink/iron combination to work. You don't necessarily need oak galls to make ink. This ink worked just fine on vellum, turning into a nice black after a few minutes. Tetchubah Cry "Bother" and let loose the Poohs of war. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 13:00:53 -0500 From: "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" Subject: Re: [scribes]: oak galls At 10:48 AM 10/7/2002 -0700, you wrote: >You don't >necessarily need oak galls to make ink. This ink worked just fine on vellum, >turning into a nice black after a few minutes. This is true! *grin* I'm gathering acorns as the days go by and I'm going to try making ink from them before I teach a class on ink making in a couple of weeks. I'll let this list know how that turns out as well. Coppras can be used as a substitute for iron with any ink recipe, so far as I know. Smiles, Despina de la this is a great conversation =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 19:44:36 +0000 From: "Megs Bulger" Subject: [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings hello everyone i am holding and running a demo for the upcoming movie lord of the rings: Twin Towers. i would like to have a booth set up of different things you can do when it comes to be being a scribe.... so if anyone will want to come and run this table i would appreciate it. that person will be aloud to see the movie for free. please e-mail be back if any of you want to do it. Sinead Killdare chase your butterflies _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 14:54:23 -0500 From: "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings At 07:44 PM 10/7/2002 +0000, Megs Bulger wrote: >hello everyone > >i am holding and running a demo for the upcoming movie lord of the rings: >Twin Towers. um, this group covers people in many places across the world. Perhaps you could be a bit more specific as to where this will be happening? Smiles, Despina de la in central Illinois =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 15:49:52 -0400 From: ESTAVASH@cs.com Subject: RE: [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings Where are you located? Ellen Salt Lake City, UT "Megs Bulger" wrote: > >hello everyone > >i am holding and running a demo for the upcoming movie lord of the rings: >Twin Towers.  i would like to have a booth set up of different things you >can do when it comes to be being a scribe.... so if anyone will want to come >and run this table i would appreciate it.  that person will be aloud to see >the movie for free.  please e-mail be back if any of you want to do it. > >Sinead Killdare > > >chase your butterflies =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 19:56:58 +0000 From: "Megs Bulger" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings ya that would help wouldn't. it is being held in Trimaris Sinead Killdare >From: "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" >To: "Megs Bulger" , scribes@castle.org >Subject: Re: [scribes]: Demo for lord of the rings >Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 14:54:23 -0500 > >At 07:44 PM 10/7/2002 +0000, Megs Bulger wrote: > >>hello everyone >> >>i am holding and running a demo for the upcoming movie lord of the rings: >>Twin Towers. > >um, this group covers people in many places across the world. Perhaps you >could be a bit more specific as to where this will be happening? > >Smiles, >Despina de la in central Illinois chase your butterflies _________________________________________________________________ Send and receive Hotmail on your mobile device: http://mobile.msn.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 07 Oct 2002 20:21:04 +0000 From: "Megs Bulger" Subject: [scribes]: demo ok so this demo will be held in Ocala which is in florida chase your butterflies _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 14:18:19 -0700 From: "Cathleen J. Winesburg-Balogh" Subject: [scribes]: Gall inks This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0046_01C26E0C.62FF8110 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Greetings all: I have been lurking on the list for a while now and have a silly = question or rather questions. I guess I should start with a brief = introduction and hope I don't have to sign off and change my name in = embarrassment for the issues I'm about to raise. My name is Cat or Lady Kathe in the SCA. I am a professional free lance = artist, and I am not new to this. I have worked in a variety of media on = a variety of surfaces, in a variety of period contexts. (Now come the = true confessions) I must admit to a preference for some modern materials = especially in relation to archival quality as it relates to durability = and preservation. I further admit that study and use of period materials is in a beginning = phase for me. The current discussion of gall inks, recipes, and effects = on vellum has raised several questions in my mind. Perhaps I should take = my questions to a book, but I thought I might just throw them out there = for general consumption. The question that arises foremost in my mind is; How do these inks stand = up to the test of time? Being of an organic and acidic nature, and = noting the reference to oxidation, are they not inherently unstable due = to decay and chemical change? In case some are knocking their arrows at the moment, let me say, I do = understand about the preservative nature of the tannic acids in relation = to the bogs and leather tanning. And I have heard the argument that some = of the manuscripts studied are 1000 plus years old. Making short of all = the issues concerned; The works we are creating today with these = materials are subjected to completely different circumstances of = exposure to heat and cold, oxygen (not to mention air quality) and = light. What are the long term effects of modern conditions on these = materials? Ducking and diving for cover just in case, thank you for your input. Cat - ------=_NextPart_000_0046_01C26E0C.62FF8110 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Greetings all:
 
I have been lurking on the list for a = while now and=20 have a silly question or rather questions. I guess I should start with a = brief=20 introduction and hope I don't have to sign off and change my name in=20 embarrassment for the issues I'm about to raise.
 
My name is Cat or Lady Kathe in the = SCA. I am a=20 professional free lance artist, and I am not new to this. I have worked = in a=20 variety of media on a variety of surfaces, in a variety of period = contexts. (Now=20 come the true confessions) I must admit to a preference for some modern=20 materials especially in relation to archival quality as it relates to = durability=20 and preservation.
 
I further admit that = study and use of=20 period materials is in a beginning phase for me. The current discussion=20 of gall inks, recipes, and effects on vellum has raised several = questions=20 in my mind. Perhaps I should take my questions to a book, but I thought = I might=20 just throw them out there for general consumption.
 
The question that arises foremost in my = mind is;=20 How do these inks stand up to the test of time? Being of an organic and = acidic=20 nature, and noting the reference to oxidation, are they not inherently = unstable=20 due to decay and chemical change?
 
In case some are knocking their arrows = at the=20 moment, let me say, I do understand about the preservative nature of the = tannic=20 acids in relation to the bogs and leather tanning. And I have heard the argument that some of the manuscripts = studied are=20 1000 plus years old. Making short of all the issues concerned; The works = we are=20 creating today with these materials are subjected to completely = different=20 circumstances of exposure to heat and cold, oxygen (not to mention air = quality)=20 and light. What are the long term effects of modern conditions on these=20 materials?
 
Ducking and diving for cover just in case, thank you for your = input.
Cat
- ------=_NextPart_000_0046_01C26E0C.62FF8110-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 17:22:38 EDT From: Floriligeum@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: oak galls - --part1_116.18795e82.2ad3551e_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The only gum arabic I have is the W&N kind in liquid form in a jar. Is that OK, or do I need to find it in its solid form and process that into the ink? What kind of ratio of gum arabic to ink solution do I want to aim for? Yours in service, Sarra the Lymner Caer Adamant (DE), East Kingdom MKA Sarah Dressler Sarra's Florilegium www.sarrasflorilegium.knownworldweb.com They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. Dost thou love life? Then do not squander time, for that is the stuff life is made of. There never was a good war or a bad peace. Benjamin Franklin 1706 - 1790 "To repeat what others have said, requires education; to challenge it, requires brains." Mary Pettibone Poole, A Glass Eye at a Keyhole, 1938 - --part1_116.18795e82.2ad3551e_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The only gum arabic I have is the W&N kind in liquid form in a jar.  Is that OK, or do I need to find it in its solid form and process that into the ink?

What kind of ratio of gum arabic to ink solution do I want to aim for?

Yours in service,

Sarra the Lymner

Caer Adamant (DE), East Kingdom
MKA Sarah Dressler
Sarra's Florilegium
www.sarrasflorilegium.knownworldweb.com

       They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.
       Dost thou love life? Then do not squander time, for that is the stuff life is made of.
       There never was a good war or a bad peace.                        Benjamin Franklin 1706 - 1790
"To repeat what others have said, requires education; to challenge it, requires brains."
                                                                      Mary Pettibone Poole, A Glass Eye at a Keyhole, 1938 - --part1_116.18795e82.2ad3551e_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 7 Oct 2002 17:29:02 EDT From: BessdeNevell@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gall inks - --part1_115.18bb925d.2ad3569e_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In short.. yes. In principle deterioration of paper by iron gall inks is largely a result of the action of the inks consisting of iron of diverse other transition metal ions, such as copper or zinc. The support material suffers an extensive gradual decline in its natural properties which in the end makes its further use as an information medium impossible. As early as about 100 years ago the head of the Vatican Library, F. Ehrle, worried about the problem of ink damage and warned of the impending destruction of numerous documents and manuscripts. The conference he called to St. Gall in 1898 was the starting point for the systematic and scientific research for an explanation of the causes of this degenerative process. The reasons for this destruction are not fully understood yet, although numerous theories have been proposed to explain the degradation of papyrus, paper and parchment objects. The desire to conserve these items necessitates the development of effective treatment methods, which can only be possible after determination of the chemical causes for deterioration. For in depth information visit the ink corrosion website: http://www.knaw.nl/ecpa/ink/index.html Cheers! ~Bess - --part1_115.18bb925d.2ad3569e_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In short.. yes. 

In principle deterioration of paper by iron gall inks is largely a result of the action of the inks consisting of iron of diverse other transition metal ions, such as copper or zinc. The support material suffers an extensive gradual decline in its natural properties which in the end makes its further use as an information medium impossible. As early as about 100 years ago the head of the Vatican Library, F. Ehrle, worried about the problem of ink damage and warned of the impending destruction of numerous documents and manuscripts. The conference he called to St. Gall in 1898 was the starting point for the systematic and scientific research for an explanation of the causes of this degenerative process.

The reasons for this destruction are not fully understood yet, although numerous theories have been proposed to explain the degradation of papyrus, paper and parchment objects. The desire to conserve these items necessitates the development of effective treatment methods, which can only be possible after determination of the chemical causes for deterioration.

For in depth information visit the ink corrosion website:
http://www.knaw.nl/ecpa/ink/index.html



Cheers!

~Bess



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