From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V8 #57 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Tuesday, September 17 2002 Volume 08 : Number 057 ======================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with unsubscribe scribes-digets in the body of the message. Leave the subject line blank. Do not include any additional text. [scribes]: my recent scroll RE: [scribes]: my recent scroll Re: [scribes]: Nontoxic gesso? Re: [scribes]: speaking of earwax Re: [scribes]: my recent scroll Re: [scribes]: speaking of earwax [scribes]: gold leaf [scribes]: my recent scroll Re: [scribes]: my recent scroll - and your rights to publish them... Fwd: [scribes]: speaking of earwax Re: Fwd: [scribes]: speaking of earwax [scribes]: RE: speaking of earwax Re: [scribes]: RE: speaking of earwax [scribes]: Clove oil (was: RE: speaking of earwax) [scribes]: Quick Question about liquid gold leaf Re: [scribes]: RE: speaking of earwax [scribes]: Slightly odd question Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question Re: [scribes]: my recent scroll - and your rights to publish them... Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question Re: [scribes]: my recent scroll Re: [scribes]: RE: speaking of earwax Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 14:15:19 +1000 From: "Annette Wilson" Subject: [scribes]: my recent scroll Greetings everyone, well, I finally sent off my latest scroll for signing and sealing, so, now that it is beyond my grasp, I though I would ask for comment - I have another 2 like it to do. It's based on a grant of 1484 (Richard III) and done on Kangaroo skin vellum. What looks like a fold is not - it is the result of me having to scan it in two halves and then trying to line it up. It's at: http://www.anbg.gov.au/abrs/flora/temp/jayscroll.jpg hidden in my work webserver. Warning, it's big (565 kb) The recipient has given me permission to show it. All the best Leonie de Grey Barony of Politarchopolis, Lochac Annette Wilson Editor, Flora ABRS GPO Box 787 CANBERRA ACT 2601 AUSTRALIA (Street address - Franklin Building Australian National Botanical Gardens Clunies Ross St, ACTON, ACT, 2600) ph: +61 (0)2 6250 9417 fax: +61 (0)2 6250 9448 email: annette.wilson@ea.gov.au =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 15 Sep 2002 23:32:29 -0500 From: "Helen Schultz" Subject: RE: [scribes]: my recent scroll What a wonder piece of work, Leonie!! Your calligraphy is lovely and your whitework fine and true. Congratulations on a project well done!! You can be quite proud of your efforts. Meisterin Katarina Helene von Schönborn, OL Shire of Narrental (Peru, Indiana) Middle Kingdom http://meisterin.katarina.home.insightbb.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 12:46:36 +0800 From: Jean-Paul Blaquiere Subject: Re: [scribes]: Nontoxic gesso? > On Sep 11, Cindy Baker illuminated : > Yes, you can simply substitute titanium white for the lead white. > The two pigments are not exactly the same, but titanium will work fine in > your gesso recipe. > after a discussion on the weekend about raised gilding and my desire to learn how to at some stage in the not too distant future, I was browsing through the archives for gesso recipes. ahhh useful archives. Will gouache (titanium white/permanent white) work in place of the lead/titanium white mentioned above? or should one find them as as powder? ./jehan - -- Jean-Paul Blaquiere || Avatar of Computational japester@ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au || Thaumaturgy http://japester.ucc.asn.au || verum ipsum factum Questions are dangerous, for they have answers =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 06:07:59 -0400 From: "Dianne and Greg Stucki" Subject: Re: [scribes]: speaking of earwax Thanks---that sounds a bit more palatable! Laurensa - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2002 11:47 PM Subject: Re: [scribes]: speaking of earwax > In a message dated 9/15/2002 12:00:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > wyverns@earthlink.net writes: > > << Of the two, I think much > of the concern scribe-wise is the aeration, and that can be minimized > with the addition of a tiny bit of earwax in many recipis. > >> > > Speaking of earwax... I recently came across a book that said one way to get > rid of bubbles in gesso was to add a tiny drop of 'oil of clove'.... just > thought I'd pass that on to the ear wax averse scribal population. > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 07:11:29 -0500 From: "Pafra & Scott Catledge" Subject: Re: [scribes]: my recent scroll Very nicely done. Colm Dubh - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Annette Wilson" To: Sent: Sunday, September 15, 2002 11:15 PM Subject: [scribes]: my recent scroll > Greetings everyone, > > well, I finally sent off my latest scroll for signing and sealing, so, > now that it is beyond my grasp, I though I would ask for comment - I > have another 2 like it to do. It's based on a grant of 1484 (Richard > III) and done on Kangaroo skin vellum. What looks like a fold is not - > it is the result of me having to scan it in two halves and then trying > to line it up. > It's at: > http://www.anbg.gov.au/abrs/flora/temp/jayscroll.jpg > hidden in my work webserver. Warning, it's big (565 kb) > > The recipient has given me permission to show it. > > All the best > > Leonie de Grey > Barony of Politarchopolis, Lochac > > > > Annette Wilson > Editor, Flora > ABRS > GPO Box 787 > CANBERRA ACT 2601 > AUSTRALIA > > (Street address - > Franklin Building > Australian National Botanical Gardens > Clunies Ross St, > ACTON, ACT, 2600) > > ph: +61 (0)2 6250 9417 > fax: +61 (0)2 6250 9448 > email: annette.wilson@ea.gov.au > ============================================================ ======= > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 16 Sep 2002 19:09:25 -0700 From: Maria faul Subject: Re: [scribes]: speaking of earwax Hello All, Just thought I'd pass along that clove oil is expensive. My husband makes Japanese swords and uses clove oil in the care of the blade when completed. Although clove oil does smell quite nice. Have a great day and hope that you enjoy your endeavors!! Maria del Norte aka. Maria Faul Mists, West ArtsofPalm@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 9/15/2002 12:00:42 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > wyverns@earthlink.net writes: > > << Of the two, I think much > of the concern scribe-wise is the aeration, and that can be minimized > with the addition of a tiny bit of earwax in many recipis. > >> > > Speaking of earwax... I recently came across a book that said one way to get > rid of bubbles in gesso was to add a tiny drop of 'oil of clove'.... just > thought I'd pass that on to the ear wax averse scribal population. > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 05:32:43 -0700 (PDT) From: Barb Ding Subject: [scribes]: gold leaf Greetings, fellow scribes, An acquaintance of mine, Master Henry, is selling a quantity of gold leaf books for $30 a book, postage included. I offered to him to forward it to these lists, thinking folks might be interested. Here are the specs: Best English Gold Leaf 'Old London' brand Manufactured by George M. Whiley Ltd, South Ruislip, England 23 1/4 carat, double weight, standard sized book, looks very nice, a deep gold color Please respond directly to Master Henry and not to me or the list! He can be reached at: portatif@concentric.net Feel free to cross-post as appropriate; I'm posting this to SCA Scribes and EK Scribes. Many thanks! Dorren __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 05:41:06 -0700 (PDT) From: Jane Subject: [scribes]: my recent scroll - --0-1206693542-1032266466=:18154 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Leonie de Grey wrote: "I though I would ask for comment - I have another 2 like it to do. It's based on a grant of 1484 (Richard III) and done on Kangaroo skin vellum. What looks like a fold is not - it is the result of me having to scan it in two halves and then trying to line it up. It's at: http://www.anbg.gov.au/abrs/flora/temp/jayscroll.jpg hidden in my work webserver. Warning, it's big (565 kb)" Dear Leonie, Your scroll is beautiful! Very nicely done.....you are talented!!! Regards, Jane - --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines - --0-1206693542-1032266466=:18154 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

Leonie de Grey wrote:

"I though I would ask for comment - I
have another 2 like it to do. It's based on a grant of 1484 (Richard
III) and done on Kangaroo skin vellum. What looks like a fold is not -
it is the result of me having to scan it in two halves and then trying
to line it up.
It's at:
http://www.anbg.gov.au/abrs/flora/temp/jayscroll.jpg
hidden in my work webserver. Warning, it's big (565 kb)"

Dear Leonie,

Your scroll is beautiful! Very nicely done.....you are talented!!!

Regards,

Jane


 


Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! News - Today's headlines - --0-1206693542-1032266466=:18154-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 15:13:36 EDT From: ArtsofPalm@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: my recent scroll - and your rights to publish them... Meisterin Katarina is quite right... it is a lovely scroll. The calligraphy is just beautiful (this calligraphy stuff is truly a difficult part of the scroll work for me...) I hope you start a trend, Leonie, and that other scribes post their work as they go. Something you wrote made me start wondering, though... is it not true that the artist retains the copyright of these scrolls... and, therefore, receiving permission from the recipient is more a matter of courtesy than of legalities and all (does there need to be an 'all rights reserved' type notice on the backs of these scrolls to prevent confusion? =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 15:18:59 EDT From: ArtsofPalm@aol.com Subject: Fwd: [scribes]: speaking of earwax - --part1_41.23754eff.2ab8da23_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit - --part1_41.23754eff.2ab8da23_boundary Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Disposition: inline Return-path: From: ArtsofPalm@aol.com Full-name: ArtsofPalm Message-ID: <78.2cd1d4c9.2ab8da0c@aol.com> Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 15:18:36 EDT Subject: Re: [scribes]: speaking of earwax To: mfaul@earthlink.net MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 5.0 for Windows sub 108 In a message dated 9/16/2002 10:15:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time, mfaul@earthlink.net writes: << Just thought I'd pass along that clove oil is expensive. My husband makes Japanese swords and uses clove oil in the care of the blade when completed. Although clove oil does smell quite nice. >> Hmmm.... I'm not sure as my 'baby' is now almost 15, but isn't it an essential ingredient in Ambesol and other baby teething rubs? - --part1_41.23754eff.2ab8da23_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 13:41:37 -0700 From: Maria faul Subject: Re: Fwd: [scribes]: speaking of earwax Hello, > > Hmmm.... I'm not sure as my 'baby' is now almost 15, but isn't it an > > essential ingredient in Ambesol and other baby teething rubs? I just grab a bottle of Baby Orajel, and the active ingredient that is listed is Benzocaine 7.5 %. I have no idea if it is the same as "clove oil" (oil of clove). I am not a chemist and do not know if that is the same. Any Chemists out there who could answer this??? > > Ah, but clove oil is simple to make. One needs a proper vegetable oil > [safflower, peanut, even canola will work]. Warm it to very warm but not > hot. Put in your cloves. Let sit for up to 3 weeks, shaking several [3-4] > times per day, in a warm window. Strain. Voila! Clove oil. I would suggest > using an oil that is compatible with your paint medium, though. Most should > be, but I could be wrong. > > Oh - measurements of oil to cloves. Approximately 1/2 cup oil to 2 > tablespoons whole cloves. > > Hope this helps... > YiS ~ > ~ Nettie I had received this post and thought that the receipe would be a good one, but my interpretation of the original message had stated 'oil of clove' which to me means the essential oil of the clove and not a mixture of vegetable oil and cloves. As I had posted to her I would love to know if anyone out there has used this oil mixture and what their results were so that I could learn something new. Anyways, I hope all have a great day and good luck in all their endeavours!! Maria del Norte aka Maria Faul Mists, West ArtsofPalm@aol.com wrote: > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Subject: Re: [scribes]: speaking of earwax > Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 15:18:36 EDT > From: ArtsofPalm@aol.com > To: mfaul@earthlink.net > > In a message dated 9/16/2002 10:15:02 PM Eastern Daylight Time, > mfaul@earthlink.net writes: > > << Just thought I'd pass along that clove oil is expensive. My husband > makes Japanese swords and uses clove oil in the care of the blade when > completed. Although clove oil does smell quite nice. >> > > Hmmm.... I'm not sure as my 'baby' is now almost 15, but isn't it an > essential ingredient in Ambesol and other baby teething rubs? =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 14:11:08 -0700 (PDT) From: Sunshine Subject: [scribes]: RE: speaking of earwax - --0-260606721-1032297068=:54298 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii benzocaine also called; Americaine, Solarcaine, Dermoplast, Bicozene, Lanacane, Foille, Chigger-Tox, and Anacainelocal is a local anaesthetic. It has nothing to do with cloves and has no oil actualy in it. I would adamently say do -not- use this for anything other than as a topical anaesthic, it would really mess up gesso I belive. Because its primarily in a solution of alcohol in most cases, and alcohol and gesso don't mix. If anyone -does- try it, let me know how it turns out? In service, Constance ~~ Damnant quod non intellegunt ~~ - --------------------------------- Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines - --0-260606721-1032297068=:54298 Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii

benzocaine also called; Americaine, Solarcaine, Dermoplast, Bicozene, Lanacane, Foille, Chigger-Tox, and Anacainelocal is a local anaesthetic. It has nothing to do with cloves and has no oil actualy in it. I would adamently say do -not- use this for anything other than as a topical anaesthic, it would really mess up gesso I belive. Because its primarily in a solution of alcohol in most cases, and alcohol and gesso don't mix. If anyone -does- try it, let me know how it turns out?

In service,

Constance



~~ Damnant quod non intellegunt ~~


Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! News - Today's headlines - --0-260606721-1032297068=:54298-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 14:34:05 -0700 From: Carolyn_Richardson@prosystemfx.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: RE: speaking of earwax >>and alcohol and gesso don't mix. << Not necessarily. When gilding wood, something is frequently used called "gilder's alcohol" which is a combination of water and alcohol (I think of the rubbing variety but not sure on that). The alcohol really doesn't bother the gesso at all - it's just used as a medium to make the liquid evaporate faster, so you can gild faster. It's used primarily by picture framers, IIRC. I wouldn't recommend using alcohol when making gesso, though. But it can be used with gesso. Tetchubah Cry "Bother" and let loose the Poohs of war. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 18:04:13 -0400 From: ESTAVASH@cs.com Subject: [scribes]: Clove oil (was: RE: speaking of earwax) Actually, the best bet for getting clove oil would be a good herb shop or health food store that carries aromatherapy supplies. Aura Cacia is a common brand, and they make clove bud essential oil (the strong stuff, which can burn your skin if it's not diluted) in 1/2 oz bottles for under $10. Since it sounds like you only use tiny drops of it with the gesso, this quantity would probably last for years. Ellen =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 18:37:07 -0400 From: Marina Subject: [scribes]: Quick Question about liquid gold leaf Now before you all go ick, eew, and the like, please know that I am new , and have not as yet dared attempt real gold leaf. My question is, can you burnish liquid gold leaf, and make it look decent? Marina of Starhaven =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 15:52:12 -0700 (PDT) From: Hillary Greenslade Subject: Re: [scribes]: RE: speaking of earwax - --- Carolyn_Richardson@prosystemfx.com wrote: > >>and alcohol and gesso don't mix. << > Not necessarily. When gilding wood, something is frequently used called > "gilder's alcohol" which is a combination of water and alcohol (I think of > the rubbing variety but not sure on that). > Tetchubah > It's probably a 'denatured alcohol' rather than rubbing alcohol. Rubbing is prepared primarily for medicinal uses, but denatured, a bit different mix, is used in cleaning items, as well as for burning in alcohol oil lamps, used primarily by jewelers. I don't think you can purchase denatured at the drugstore, but may find it at the hardware store, certainly at jewelry suppliers. Hillary __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 16:23:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Jon Price Subject: [scribes]: Slightly odd question Morning All! I have been asked by a friend to create a calligraphic marriage certificate for them, which is fine and happy. However, as this is a quaker service, I have just found out that everyone present is meant to sign the certificate. Not in itself a problem, there will be plenty of space. They want the thing framed and hung on their wall to loom over them. Great. My inks and pigments and gold leaf are safe. So, the question is: what should I recommend for the signing ? Biros are completely out stylistically, and fountain pens would be the obvious choice. I have had a quick ask around the vendors of fountain pens, and they all say that putting a carbon based calligraphic ink through a fountain pen is bad and will clog it up beyond use. The standard inks for fountain pens are a bit washy, and some I have seen are fading after 7 years - not good for a marriage certificate, they want on display for their married lives, which (all hope) will be amny, many years. Any thoughts on the subject ? Should I get the cheapest fountain pen I can and put the most dilute chinese stick ink (which is 'thinner' then my usual calligraphic inks) through it that I thinki I can get away with and hope that all will be fine ? Thanks! Jon Price. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 18:55:41 -0500 From: "Pafra & Scott Catledge" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question Why not get an inexpensive Speedball set of nibs and staff for use with calligraphy ink that will last. Colm Dubh - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jon Price" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 6:23 PM Subject: [scribes]: Slightly odd question > Morning All! > > I have been asked by a friend to create a calligraphic marriage > certificate for them, which is fine and happy. > > However, as this is a quaker service, I have just found out that > everyone present is meant to sign the certificate. Not in itself a > problem, there will be plenty of space. > > They want the thing framed and hung on their wall to loom over them. > Great. My inks and pigments and gold leaf are safe. > > So, the question is: what should I recommend for the signing ? Biros > are completely out stylistically, and fountain pens would be the > obvious choice. I have had a quick ask around the vendors of fountain > pens, and they all say that putting a carbon based calligraphic ink > through a fountain pen is bad and will clog it up beyond use. The > standard inks for fountain pens are a bit washy, and some I have seen > are fading after 7 years - not good for a marriage certificate, they > want on display for their married lives, which (all hope) will be amny, > many years. > > Any thoughts on the subject ? Should I get the cheapest fountain pen I > can and put the most dilute chinese stick ink (which is 'thinner' then > my usual calligraphic inks) through it that I thinki I can get away > with and hope that all will be fine ? > > Thanks! > > Jon Price. > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! News - Today's headlines > http://news.yahoo.com > ============================================================ ======= > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 17:50:20 -0700 From: Carolyn_Richardson@prosystemfx.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question Jon, I think you can find calligraphy pens that will take either take good ink, or better yet if you can find a disposable calligraphy pen that comes with it's own sealed cartridge that might be the ticket. I think the best place to look might be one of those scrapbooking stores/suppliers, since they try to sell everything acid free and permanent. Tetchubah Cry "Bother" and let loose the Poohs of war. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 18:05:42 -0700 (PDT) From: Hillary Greenslade Subject: Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question - --- Jon Price wrote: > Morning All! > I have been asked by a friend to create a calligraphic marriage > certificate for them, which is fine and happy. > (snip) > So, the question is: what should I recommend for the signing ? > > Jon Price. I wouldn't recommend giving the guests a dip pen with ink, as they will most likely cause many ink blots and torn fibers. Dip pens take a bit of getting used to for the first time user. I have used a fountain pen, where I take an empty cartridge and fill it with india ink using a syringe or pipet. Your source is right, not a good idea to store the pen with the india ink cartridge as it can clog, and you will want to clean the nib thoroughly after use. But it will be ok for the few hours usage to do the signing. And it will be a lot easier to manipulate. Test it out first a few days before, to make sure you got the ink flowing well with your choice of fountain pens, before taking the pen to the wedding. (Again, remove the cartridge and clean nib after testing.) I have use Platignum and Schaeffer fountain pens using this method, quite successfully. You may also want to put out a blank pad of paper, maybe you could make a small book, of the original paper, and label the pages 'tester', so they can try the pen before they write on the document. As a final alternate, you could just provide black ink ball point pens and let them use that, so the ink is the same color for all the signatures. Best of luck, Hillary __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 09:34:43 +0800 From: Jean-Paul Blaquiere Subject: Re: [scribes]: my recent scroll - and your rights to publish them... > On Sep 17, ArtsofPalm@aol.com illuminated : > Something you wrote made me start wondering, though... is it not true that > the artist retains the copyright of these scrolls... and, therefore, > receiving permission from the recipient is more a matter of courtesy than of > legalities and all (does there need to be an 'all rights reserved' type > notice on the backs of these scrolls to prevent confusion? > definately in Australia yes, all works of art (fine details, see a lawyer etc) are copyrighted as a matter of course, you do not need to put (c) blah blah on them. As a matter of courtesy, especially as this is an award scroll, it is courteous to the receiver to ask because they may not see the scroll before the rest of the world does if it is published on the web as soon as it is finished, or even sealed. ./jehan - -- Jean-Paul Blaquiere || Avatar of Computational japester@ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au || Thaumaturgy http://japester.ucc.asn.au || verum ipsum factum Questions are dangerous, for they have answers =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 18:48:47 -0700 From: "Tammy L. Williams" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question I would recommend a Rotring cartridge pen (with Rotring black ink cartridges) - they come in several nib sizes 2.7, 1.9, 1.5, 1.1, F (fine) and EF (extra fine). The ink is pretty permanent although not water waterproof . I've only been using them for the last two years (after long searches for cartridge pens that would work with a permanent ink without becoming clogged) and have a friend who uses them and swears by Rotring ink (do not get the "shiny" kind though it doesn't look right) who has been using them for about a decade. At least two sets of Royalty and a Baronial couple have been using them to sign their names (including perpendicular usage to write Runes) which is to say if they can handle them most guests should be able to handle them:-} Tam - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jon Price" To: Sent: Tuesday, September 17, 2002 4:23 PM Subject: [scribes]: Slightly odd question > Morning All! > > I have been asked by a friend to create a calligraphic marriage > certificate for them, which is fine and happy. > > However, as this is a quaker service, I have just found out that > everyone present is meant to sign the certificate. Not in itself a > problem, there will be plenty of space. > > They want the thing framed and hung on their wall to loom over them. > Great. My inks and pigments and gold leaf are safe. > > So, the question is: what should I recommend for the signing ? Biros > are completely out stylistically, and fountain pens would be the > obvious choice. I have had a quick ask around the vendors of fountain > pens, and they all say that putting a carbon based calligraphic ink > through a fountain pen is bad and will clog it up beyond use. The > standard inks for fountain pens are a bit washy, and some I have seen > are fading after 7 years - not good for a marriage certificate, they > want on display for their married lives, which (all hope) will be amny, > many years. > > Any thoughts on the subject ? Should I get the cheapest fountain pen I > can and put the most dilute chinese stick ink (which is 'thinner' then > my usual calligraphic inks) through it that I thinki I can get away > with and hope that all will be fine ? > > Thanks! > > Jon Price. > > __________________________________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Yahoo! News - Today's headlines > http://news.yahoo.com > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 18 Sep 2002 10:19:17 +0800 From: Jean-Paul Blaquiere Subject: Re: [scribes]: my recent scroll > On Sep 16, Annette Wilson illuminated : > well, I finally sent off my latest scroll for signing and sealing, so, > now that it is beyond my grasp, I though I would ask for comment - I > have another 2 like it to do. It's based on a grant of 1484 (Richard > III) and done on Kangaroo skin vellum. What looks like a fold is not - > it is the result of me having to scan it in two halves and then trying > to line it up. > what was it like working on kangaroo vellum? I was talking with neryssa when she was over here last weekend, and she said that she had tried kangaroo and had a bad experience with it. also, where did you get it from? ./jehan - -- Jean-Paul Blaquiere || Avatar of Computational japester@ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au || Thaumaturgy http://japester.ucc.asn.au || verum ipsum factum Questions are dangerous, for they have answers =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 23:35:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" Subject: Re: [scribes]: RE: speaking of earwax On Tue, 17 Sep 2002, Sunshine wrote: > ...and alcohol and gesso don't mix. I dunno; my last gesso project certainly drove me to drink... Graidhne =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 17 Sep 2002 21:13:09 -0700 (PDT) From: Jon Price Subject: Re: [scribes]: Slightly odd question Thanks to all! Jon. __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! News - Today's headlines http://news.yahoo.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V8 #57 ****************************