From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V8 #21 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Friday, July 5 2002 Volume 08 : Number 021 ======================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with unsubscribe scribes-digets in the body of the message. Leave the subject line blank. Do not include any additional text. RE: [scribes]: brause nibs [scribes]: searching Meister Harold von Auerbach [scribes]: hemophiliac paper question Re: [scribes]: searching Meister Harold von Auerbach Re: [scribes]: calligraphy-only scrolls Re: [scribes]: Speaking of gold leaf... Re: [scribes]: calligraphy-only scrolls [scribes]: Inking your drawing Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing [scribes]: Another Recent Scroll Re: [scribes]: Another Recent Scroll Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Re: [scribes]: letters of Marque [scribes]: Re: calligraphy-only scrolls [scribes]: think outside the scrolls box Re: [scribes]: Another Recent Scroll Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing [scribes]: Paint blending experiment Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing [scribes]: Winsor & Newton Watercolors Re: [scribes]: Another Recent Scroll Re: [scribes]: Back of Scroll (was: Another Recent Scroll) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 13:28:01 -0600 From: "Crystal Olsen" Subject: RE: [scribes]: brause nibs Thank you, your Excellency! If Lady Bethany can't find hers. I may need to contact you... or order one myself. We should have a scribal workshop to just work on projects in process. (My home is always available, especially since Grifon works nights now) So, if anyone from Loch Salann, Gryphon's Lair or Cote du Ciel is interested, let me know and I'll clean off the tables. :) Regards, Jaquelinne Gryphon's Lair, Artemisia - -----Original Message----- From: ESTAVASH@cs.com [mailto:ESTAVASH@cs.com] Sent: Wednesday, July 03, 2002 11:45 AM To: scribes@castle.org Subject: RE: [scribes]: brause nibs Try John Neil Books (their catalog is online) or Paper & Ink Arts (you can request a free catalog by email.) For most nibs, Paper & Ink is slightly cheaper. In your case, I suggest borrowing a catalog from me or Lady Bethany... ;) I prefer Mitchell myself (I'm a leftie, and although I can use oblique nibs slanted in either direction, they're not my favorite) but I have some Brause nibs at home-- I'll check and see what sizes I can scrounge up for you. Ellen Loch Salann, Artemisia =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 21:39:33 +0200 From: merlyn@virulent.de Subject: [scribes]: searching Meister Harold von Auerbach Greetings all, I am sooooo sorry to bend bandwidth, but I would like to know if anyone here knows how to reach Meister Harold von Auerbach, if he is well and if he still has email. Please contact me off list. I was apprenticed to him some years ago but am now living in Drachenwald ( very long story) and have a scroll that needs to go to him. Yis Bridget Greywolf - house Blackwood - --- September 24th, AS XXIII Oddly enough, no one wanted to be seneschal." shire history of Ar n-eilean-ne =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 15:50:21 -0400 From: Lisa Kuney Subject: [scribes]: hemophiliac paper question > > >hdorsett@alaska.net wrote: > >>> >>> I have a project to complete on paper that bleeds incredibly. My first >>> choice would be to substitute a better paper, but I don't have that >>> option in this case. Are there any types of ink that are [_much_] less >>> prone to bleeding than others, or is there anything I can use to treat >>> the paper so it will be less absorbent? >>> >>> Helena Ochastka >>> Barony of Winter's Gate, West >>> Fairbanks, Alaska >> Well, as someone who makes paper, my first thought is to size the existing paper with starch or some such. I have even used the spray starch used for clothing to good effect to "seal" the paper and make it bleed less. You can also dip into a gelatin and/or starch bath and let dry. I cannot lay my hands on it right this minute but my mother (a wonderful artist) sent me some scanned pages from an old book on the history of papermaking that details the bath/dip process. If I can find them, I will email them to you as an attachment. Halima al-Shaffi Stronghold of Raven's Cove =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 17:47:54 -0400 From: "Kara Westfall" Subject: Re: [scribes]: searching Meister Harold von Auerbach replied privately. :) =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:07:04 +0930 From: "Kat" Subject: Re: [scribes]: calligraphy-only scrolls ....Letters of Marque.... I have been researching this and haven't managed to find any actual period written examples - has anyone got any references that may help? Katerina Innilgard - ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, July 04, 2002 2:30 AM Subject: Re: [scribes]: calligraphy-only scrolls > In a message dated Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:27:42 AM Eastern Standard Time, tabby@ott.igs.net writes: > > > > > > > Greetings from Genevieve, > > > > I'm a calligrapher first, and illuminator a distant second. > > > > I'm keen to do scrolls, and want to work with my strengths. I am looking for > > examples as models where the art is in the calligraphy, more than the illumination, > > where really gorgeous writing was the point of the piece, with perhaps one or > > two rubricated letters, rather than the book-of-hours-page look. > > > > I'm not sure what period I should be looking at, though I did see one lovely > > example in a 15th c. batarde hand recently, by Dame Sarra Graeham. > > > > Can anyone direct me to suitable examples, in either books or online? I'm game > > to try new hands and styles. > > > > Regards, > > > > Genevieve la flechiere > > Skraeling Althing, Ealdormere > > > > =================================================================== > > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > > with a blank Subject: line and > > unsubscribe scribes > > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional > > text in > > the body. > > http://nazrynn.8m.com/Berangere_Terp-AoA1.JPG > > This is a scroll I did with nothing other than callig for the artwork, and was assured to me as "period" in the technique of including shapes in different colored inks within the actual calligraphy on the page. (Person assuring is/was a Laurel) > > You could also check into Letters of Marque, or do a search under "Cadels". :) > > Hope this helps! > Good luck! > > --Lady Kayleigh McWhyte, "Mercenary Scribe" (East) > 'Beth Frank, Long Island NY > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 21:48:43 EDT From: BRNDALSTON@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Speaking of gold leaf... - --part1_131.1029c5e4.2a55037b_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 7/3/2002 1:16:30 AM Eastern Daylight Time, kara_westfall@hotmail.com writes: > There is absolutely nothing different about > the gold itself, so why would it look different than loose leaf? The only > thing I can > think of is that one might be using a much thinner leaf in the patent. I > try to get > the highest gram weight per 1000 leaves I can find, and my gilding with the > patent > leaf looks no different than with loose (even Cennini weight). If anything, > it looks better. > It could very well be the weight. My patent gold is much thinner than the loose leaf stuff I got from Master John. There is also a color difference between the two. Humidity could explain a lot. I live in Hampton Roads, VA where humidity levels rarely get below 60% most of the year. With no air conditioning, EVERYTHING in the house is sticky! Probably my jagged edges are a result of the gold sticking to the backing paper more than to the gesso. Thanks for the info! Brandy - --part1_131.1029c5e4.2a55037b_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 7/3/2002 1:16:30 AM Eastern Daylight Time, kara_westfall@hotmail.com writes:


There is absolutely nothing different about
the gold itself, so why would it look different than loose leaf? The only thing I can
think of is that one might be using a much thinner leaf  in the patent. I try to get
the highest gram weight per 1000 leaves I can find, and my gilding with the patent
leaf looks no different than with loose (even Cennini weight). If anything, it looks better.


It could very well be the weight. My patent gold is much thinner than the loose leaf stuff I got from Master John. There is also a color difference between the two.

Humidity could explain a lot. I live in Hampton Roads, VA where humidity levels rarely get below 60% most of the year. With no air conditioning, EVERYTHING in the house is sticky! Probably my jagged edges are a result of the gold sticking to the backing paper more than to the gesso.

Thanks for the info!
Brandy - --part1_131.1029c5e4.2a55037b_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 03 Jul 2002 23:46:03 -0400 From: dragonazure@charter.net Subject: Re: [scribes]: calligraphy-only scrolls Greetings from Eldred! I have a reference to what you seek! In Ottfried Neubecker's _Heraldry: Sources, Symbols, and Meaning_, there is an example on pages 246 and 247 of an augmentation of arms that is primarily calligraphy. It is a grant from Emperor Frederick III to the city of Vienna on 12 August 1461. The only illumination is a small depiction of the arms granted by the Emperor. For an earlier example, I have a printout of an image of a land grant from King Stephen (England, 1135-1151) that has no illumination whatsoever. If I can find the page I found it on, I'll send the link. In service, Eldred Ælfwald Web-Deputy for Atlantia's Clerk Signet Kat wrote: > > ....Letters of Marque.... > I have been researching this and haven't managed to find any actual period > written examples - > has anyone got any references that may help? > Katerina > Innilgard > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: > Sent: Thursday, July 04, 2002 2:30 AM > Subject: Re: [scribes]: calligraphy-only scrolls > > > In a message dated Wed, 3 Jul 2002 11:27:42 AM Eastern Standard Time, > tabby@ott.igs.net writes: > > > > > > > > > > > Greetings from Genevieve, > > > > > > I'm a calligrapher first, and illuminator a distant second. > > > > > > I'm keen to do scrolls, and want to work with my strengths. I am looking > for > > > examples as models where the art is in the calligraphy, more than the > illumination, > > > where really gorgeous writing was the point of the piece, with perhaps > one or > > > two rubricated letters, rather than the book-of-hours-page look. > > > > > > I'm not sure what period I should be looking at, though I did see one > lovely > > > example in a 15th c. batarde hand recently, by Dame Sarra Graeham. > > > > > > Can anyone direct me to suitable examples, in either books or online? > I'm game > > > to try new hands and styles. > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Genevieve la flechiere > > > Skraeling Althing, Ealdormere > > > > > > =================================================================== > > > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > > > with a blank Subject: line and > > > unsubscribe scribes > > > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional > > > text in > > > the body. > > > > http://nazrynn.8m.com/Berangere_Terp-AoA1.JPG > > > > This is a scroll I did with nothing other than callig for the artwork, and > was assured to me as "period" in the technique of including shapes in > different colored inks within the actual calligraphy on the page. (Person > assuring is/was a Laurel) > > > > You could also check into Letters of Marque, or do a search under > "Cadels". :) > > > > Hope this helps! > > Good luck! > > > > --Lady Kayleigh McWhyte, "Mercenary Scribe" (East) > > 'Beth Frank, Long Island NY > > =================================================================== > > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > > with a blank Subject: line and > > unsubscribe scribes > > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > > the body. > > > > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 00:05:11 -0400 From: "K. Z." Subject: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Question Tell me if you can, your favorite method for inking your penciled drawing for your scrolls. Ink, nib, size and any other information that makes you life easier. Thank you, Collys Bythesea AEthelmearc Only a Pirates life for me. Mutiny is only a difference in opinions. Terra Marique Potens (Powerful by land and sea). _________________________________________________________________ Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 21:24:50 -0700 From: "Eva Mehlhose" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Question Tell me if you can, your favorite method for inking your penciled drawing for your scrolls. Ink, nib, size and any other information that makes you life easier. Personally very much in favor of Rapidograph tech pen with a very fine .25mm nib with waterproof ink in it. My students in particular like the idea of nonsmudge inked drawings....grin.... Maestra Alyssandra Atenveldt =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 00:52:39 -0700 From: brandy@ieee.org Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing I have used waterproof ink pens of size 0.2mm 0.3mm and 0.05mm. All with great success. I am almost done a white-vine work which I inked with a crow quill pen by Hunt. I don't know the quality of them - I just picked them up cheap at a sale but it worked great. I used russet coloured waterproof ink (Higgins) so that the lines were visible but not overwhelming. At first I thought that using a quill pen would be harder than using an ink pen but I actually found that using the quill pen gave me a lot of hand control that I haven't experienced with the ink pen. Morag Mare Amethystinum Thunder Bay, Ontario On 4 Jul 2002 at 0:05, K. Z. wrote: > Question > Tell me if you can, your favorite method for inking your penciled > drawing > for your scrolls. Ink, nib, size and any other information that makes > you life easier. Thank you, Collys Bythesea AEthelmearc =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 00:57:17 -0400 From: "Sally Burnell" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing > Tell me if you can, your favorite method for inking your penciled drawing > for your scrolls. Ink, nib, size and any other information that makes you > life easier. I use a Falcon E 10 mapping nib and I have been using Higgins Calligraphy ink, although when I ran out recently, I remembered that I had won in, among other things, a bottle of Calli calligraphy ink at a calligraphy contest at an event not too long ago, so that is what I am using now. I really like it compared to the Higgins. For years I used a crowquill nib for inking, but found this mapping nib to be far superior than the crowquills. Just my personal experience............... ~Saradwen Midrealm =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:52:03 +0800 From: Jean-Paul Blaquiere Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing > On Jul 04, K. Z. illuminated : > Tell me if you can, your favorite method for inking your penciled drawing > for your scrolls. Ink, nib, size and any other information that makes you > life easier. > What I have done with my limited experence, is draw in the pictures in pencil - 0.3mm B mechanical pencil (nice thin soft lines) Inking, I have done two ways. First is a 0.20mm archival quality pen that my fountain of wisdom guru Murgheinn showed me. not sure of the brand, but is has 'sakura', 'pigma' and 'micron' in large friendly letters written on the side. It does not give as black a line as gouache and brush though. Until I get consistently good at fine lines, it suffices though. Gouache, I use with a 2/0 silver sable brush and have managed to get some stupidly fine lines with it. I use this one because the length of the hairs gives me a good view to the tip of the brush and it holds its point while laden with paint very well, much better than the 3/0. I should also try the fine nib and ink at some stage ... I have a couple of map nibs which are nice and fine (order of 0.30 wide) Crows quills and similar should also do. :) Remember steady hands. ./jp - -- Jean-Paul Blaquiere || Avatar of Computational japester@ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au || Thaumaturgy http://japester.ucc.asn.au || verum ipsum factum Questions are dangerous, for they have answers =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 07:00:28 -0400 From: KMcWhyte@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Generally I use Staedtler brand drafting pens (waterproof) - they aren't too dark, and for the extra-fine details, I've been known to use the Sakura pen described previously... That's basically what I use for eyes, facial features, etc on the figures I sometimes stick in my scrolls. Generally I try to avoid inking the edges of illumination when possible, to give it more of a natural / painted feel (also because of the nagging of my art professors in in college) otherwise, in the instance of something like bar and ivy, you'd see fine inked edges all over the place. Inking pretty much is determined by the nature of the scroll. Staedtler pens are pretty easy to find, too... Any Staples will carry them in the drafting aisle. :) - --Lady Kayleigh McWhyte, "Mercenary Scribe" (East) E.Frank, Long Island NY In a message dated Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:52:03 +0800, japester@ucc.gu.uwa.edu.au writes: > > > > On Jul 04, K. Z. illuminated : > > > Tell me if you can, your favorite method for inking your penciled drawing > > for your scrolls. Ink, nib, size and any other information that makes you > > life easier. > > > What I have done with my limited experence, is draw in the pictures in > pencil - 0.3mm B mechanical pencil (nice thin soft lines) > Inking, I have done two ways. First is a 0.20mm archival quality pen that my > fountain of wisdom guru Murgheinn showed me. not sure of the brand, but > is has 'sakura', 'pigma' and 'micron' in large friendly letters written on > the side. It does not give as black a line as gouache and brush though. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 07:12:39 -0400 From: KMcWhyte@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Another Recent Scroll I guess it's safe to post this, considering this one's being handed out either today or tomorrow, and the recipient is already at that event... http://nazrynn.8m.com/Cassandra_AoA.jpg This was a no-inked-outline scroll (following the inking thread). Total production time was approx 3 hrs (amazingly fast!), though it was *not* listed on the back because 1) the recipient is one of the newbie attendees of the scriptorium I run, and 2) I have been officially asked not to place a breakdown of the hours spent on my scrolls on the backs of the scrolls, as of a discussion in mid-April. Apparently someone - not a recipient - saw one or more of the 3 scrolls I did this on while they were in the Royal Room, and felt this was snobbish, when it wasn't meant to be. (Despite discussion that the idea for it came from this list... ). I'm still happy with the results of my first attempt at an acanthus-leaf look, and artificial uncial (not my standard uncials). - --Kayleigh (An Dubhaigheainn, East) E.Frank, Long Island NY PS: Apologies in advance for the scroll not being "righted" yet... until I get this to Photoshop after this weekend, looks like everyone's going to have to turn their head on its side to view it online. (Sorry!) :) =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 04 Jul 2002 07:23:06 -0400 From: KMcWhyte@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Another Recent Scroll PPS - I just noticed the "Freeservers has changed its policy" thing if you click directly on that link. To view the image, you're going to have to type it in separately.... - --K. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 21:04:38 +0930 From: "Kat" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing I like my post office nib and ink. I have been using it for years for my 'mundane' artwork too. Katerina Innilgard. - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eva Mehlhose" To: "K. Z." ; Sent: Thursday, July 04, 2002 1:54 PM Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing > > Question > Tell me if you can, your favorite method for inking your penciled drawing > for your scrolls. Ink, nib, size and any other information that makes you > life easier. > > Personally very much in favor of Rapidograph tech pen with a very fine .25mm > nib with waterproof ink in it. My students in particular like the idea of > nonsmudge inked drawings....grin.... > Maestra Alyssandra > Atenveldt > > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 21:14:49 +0930 From: "Kat" Subject: Re: [scribes]: letters of Marque Try this one, it has samples of wording, but I personally am looking for the original calligraphed copies . Katerina Innilgard. http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Garden/5213/marque2.htm > > ....Letters of Marque.... > > I have been researching this and haven't managed to find any actual period > > written examples - > > has anyone got any references that may help? > > Katerina > > Innilgard > If you find any references to LoM's (Letters of Marque) online, would you please mind sending copies of the link over to me? My lord has been trying to research these too, for a possible charter for our (piratical) SCA household. > > Thanks! > > --Kayleigh > > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 10:17:07 EDT From: RenScribe@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Re: calligraphy-only scrolls - --part1_119.13f44c0d.2a55b2e3_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is the URL for a page that has some images of period Grants & Patents that may be useful to those wanting to do calligraphy only scrolls http://www.gryph.com/documents/images.htm especially links # 18, 20 Yvianne - --part1_119.13f44c0d.2a55b2e3_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Here is the URL for a page that has some images of period Grants & Patents that may be useful to those wanting to do calligraphy only scrolls

http://www.gryph.com/documents/images.htm
especially links #  18, 20

Yvianne - --part1_119.13f44c0d.2a55b2e3_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 11:08:38 -0700 From: "Gael Stirler" Subject: [scribes]: think outside the scrolls box This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C22346.CC99A760 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit We have just begun a project to create commemorative plates using the skills and designs we have learned as illuminators in my Gutenberg School of Scribes classes in Atenveldt. As a first step I have collected some pictures of Talavera and Majolica style pottery plates from various sources on the internet for inspiration. If you would like to look at these pictures you will find them at http://www.chivalrysports.com/talavera/index.htm I will add more pictures as I find them and I will keep you informed of how this project is going. It is our plan to eventually commemorate the reigns of our sovereigns and notable dates in our Kingdom history. Lady Dairine mor o'Uhigin Dir. Guttenberg School of Scribes Tir Ysgithr, Atenveldt Tucson, Arizona - ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C22346.CC99A760 Content-Type: text/html; charset="Windows-1252" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable [scribes]: think outside the scrolls box

We have just begun a project to create commemorative = plates using the skills and designs we have learned as illuminators in = my Gutenberg School of Scribes classes in Atenveldt. As a first step I = have collected some pictures of Talavera and Majolica style pottery = plates from various sources on the internet for inspiration. If you = would like to look at these pictures you will find them at

http://www.chiv= alrysports.com/talavera/index.htm
I will add more pictures as I find them and I will = keep you informed of how this project is going. It is our plan to = eventually commemorate the reigns of our sovereigns and notable dates in = our Kingdom history.

Lady Dairine mor o'Uhigin
Dir. Guttenberg School of Scribes
Tir Ysgithr, Atenveldt
Tucson, Arizona

- ------=_NextPart_000_0010_01C22346.CC99A760-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 14:55:22 -0400 From: "Sally Burnell" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Another Recent Scroll > http://nazrynn.8m.com/Cassandra_AoA.jpg Nice work, Kayleigh! Love your rendering of acanthus - that is a style in which I hope someday to work. I'm so stuck on the earlier styles that I haven't really ventured into anything later than, oh, about mid-15th century. In fact, right now I am working on a 13th century piece, a tad earlier than my usual 14th century bar-and-ivy stuff. So far, it's turning out nicely. It's been a challenge, to be sure, but I find I kinda like how it's turning out. It's motivated me to try other earlier period stuff. Thanks for sharing that with us, and keep up the good work! ~Saradwen Midrealm =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 13:54:48 -0700 From: "Isolde26" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Personally I use my old work horse Rapidograph and brown (or sepia) ink. The .25 Rapidograph. The brown ink will disappear into the painting, gold leafing or whatever, or one can use it as a guide if one wants to outline later in black. Isolde An Tir =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 20:38:21 -0400 From: "Sally Burnell" Subject: [scribes]: Paint blending experiment I'm working on a 13th century French scroll for Meleé in the Marche in Tirnewydd (Columbus, OH) this weekend. So far, it's turning out nicely and I am right pleased with how it looks so far. Anyway, I was blending some paints to try to achieve that kind of salmon colour you see on so many of the Gothic pieces, so I blended together some red opaque water colour with some reconstituted powdered Titanium White that I still had in my palette from another scroll I did a while back. I had made that by mixing the powdered stuff with gum arabic as the binder and then introducing distilled water with a tiny bit of oxgall in it. I also used a small amount of yellow opaque water colour to get past the pure pink and to create the desired salmon colour (well, it didn't exactly turn out the colour I wanted, but close enough!). So I decided to use this instead of my Windsor and Newton permanent white gouache to blend with the red, and most interestingly, it had a hard time blending. I had to fight a bit of streakiness as I painted with it, and had to work extra hard to get nice consistent colour as I painted. Mind you, this was purely an experiment to see how these two paints would blend. Not easily. It was work to get them to look nice on the scroll. Just thought I would share that bit of experimentation with you all! ~Saradwen Midrealm =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jul 2002 23:37:43 -0400 From: "Kara Westfall" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Inking your drawing Most of the preliminary sketches I've seen on (unfinished) manuscript pages are grey, therefore I usually use thinned down ink in a shade that looks about as light as pencil lines. I use whatever technical pen is handy and working at the moment. Crowquills and I don't get along. Chiara =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 3 Jul 2002 23:36:53 -0600 From: Greg Young/Jocelyn Wirth Subject: [scribes]: Winsor & Newton Watercolors Greetings all, I was at one of our city's art stores (they just opened a second location - grand opening specials - I got an OTT light for over 55% off - Woo Hoo, but I digress), and I noticed what appears to be a new Winsor & Newton phamplet - - "Perfecting the Fine Art of Watercolors". Picked it up. Inside it describes and explains the discontinuation of 29 colors, the modifaction of 13 colors, and the introduction of 35 new colors. 43 colors have remained unchanged. Some examples of the discontinued colors are No. 002, Alizarin Carmine (reason given as being close to another color), No. 152 Chrome Deep (toxicity and permanence), No. 540 Prussian Green (can be mixed by artist). Some examples of the new colors are: 025 Bismuth Yellow, 187 Cobalt Green (Yellow Shade), 547 Quinacridone Gold, Winsor Blue (Green Shade), Winsor Blue (Red Shade). According to the phamplet, with the introduction of the new colors and modifaction of others, all W & N watercolors are rated as either AA (extremely permanent) or A (permanent) for permanancy, with 3 exceptions being rated as B (moderately durable). Just an FYI for those who like W & N watercolors. There were no new phamplets that I could see on the gouaches. Ainesleah (I use MaimeriBlu, Venezia, and M. Graham myself) ***************************************************************************** Mistress Hermina Matilda de Ainesleah of Meredene, OL Member # 19216 HL Robin Arthur Kyrke, Esq., Forester and Sargent Member # 28653 Barony of Castel Rouge Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada Jocelyn Wirth and Greg Young excalibr@gatewest.net ****************************************************************************** =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Jul 2002 03:07:26 -0600 From: Chendra Conklin Subject: Re: [scribes]: Another Recent Scroll At 05:12 AM 7/4/02, KMcWhyte@aol.com wrote: >2) I have been officially asked not to place a breakdown of the hours >spent on my scrolls on the backs of the scrolls, as of a discussion in >mid-April. Apparently someone - not a recipient - saw one or more of the 3 >scrolls I did this on while they were in the Royal Room, and felt this was >snobbish, when it wasn't meant to be. (Despite discussion that the idea >for it came from this list... ). 'Officially asked'?!? 'Snobbish'?!? *snort* So now it's apparently not reasonable to let people know what time and effort was spent on their scroll? What would happen if people were to realize that something took more than 10 minutes? Ah yes, the serious lack of value for the scribal arts strikes again... - -the redhead- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 05 Jul 2002 08:29:28 -0400 From: KMcWhyte@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Back of Scroll (was: Another Recent Scroll) In a message dated Fri, 5 Jul 2002 4:07:26 AM Eastern Standard Time, chendra@redstonegroup.org writes: > > > At 05:12 AM 7/4/02, KMcWhyte@aol.com wrote: > >2) I have been officially asked not to place a breakdown of the hours > >spent on my scrolls on the backs of the scrolls, as of a discussion in > >mid-April. Apparently someone - not a recipient - saw one or more of the 3 > >scrolls I did this on while they were in the Royal Room, and felt this was > >snobbish, when it wasn't meant to be. (Despite discussion that the idea > >for it came from this list... ). > > > 'Officially asked'?!? 'Snobbish'?!? > > *snort* > > So now it's apparently not reasonable to let people know what time and > effort was spent on their scroll? What would happen if people were to > realize that something took more than 10 minutes? Ah yes, the serious lack > of value for the scribal arts strikes again... > > -the redhead- > > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional > text in > the body. "Officially asked", as in, the person who complained (it was not a recipient, I don't know who in the royal room it was, but I'm not about to go ignoring the discussion with the Deputy Signet in March, or recent discussion with the Signet who was not aware of the discussion in March and would not have brought it up if she had known about that discussion.... but I digress) went right to the Signet and probably other people at the time it happened (Mudthaw or back in September). I've rationalized this as "the only people who care about the hours and information on the backs of scrolls are the people who have an interest in scrolls, or scribes like us...". It may make people appreciate the scroll, it may ruffle feathers as it did here, but to remedy it, I'm just going to keep track of this info on my website or in my portfolio - which is my personal property. I'm not the only one who thinks the hours written on the back of the scroll is a good idea, but apparently I may be one of the few who did it. In any event, the matter's pretty much over with for me. (Maybe not for everyone else in East) - --the other redhead. (Kayleigh) =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V8 #21 ****************************