From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V7 #40 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Thursday, November 22 2001 Volume 07 : Number 040 ======================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with unsubscribe scribes-digets in the body of the message. Leave the subject line blank. Do not include any additional text. Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac [scribes]: Leaves of Gold & Scribes Seminar [scribes]: Re: (scribes): Gum ammoniac Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac RE: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac [scribes]: Parchment question Re: [scribes]: Parchment question [scribes]: Re:Parchment question RE: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question [scribes]: Re:Gum ammoniac Re: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question Re: [scribes]: Re:Gum ammoniac Re: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question Re: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question [scribes]: "fixing" mistakes Re: [scribes]: "fixing" mistakes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 08:15:53 -0600 From: "Margareta vanden Velde" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac I thought you just covered it up with a little bit of water and let it turn into sticky stuff all by itself. I bought some at Pennsic (not used yet) and I'm pretty sure that's what I was told. Don't know how long it keeps, but if it's just water to make it sticky, presumably it could be re- and re- and re-hydrated as need dictated. ? Apparently the darker coloured crystals (there are variations in mine) can affect the colour of the paint, if you're using them with a pale colour paint. Let me know! Margareta vanden Velde Ealdormere - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Isolde the Nimble Fingered" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2001 11:06 AM Subject: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac > I feel rather dumb. I have a variety of gesso recipes and how to's on > gilding but nothing on the preparation of gum ammoniac. Any hints as to how > to make the stuff sticky, and how long does it keep? Any advice would be > greatly appreciated. > > HL Isolde the Nimble Fingered > Kingdom of An Tir > > Per pale sable and argent, an escallop counterchanged. > > Motto: > Tytyvyllus me admittere impellit. > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 08:41:03 -0600 From: "Amy L. Hornburg Heilveil" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac - --=====================_2984451==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 11:06 AM 11/20/2001 +0000, Isolde the Nimble Fingered wrote: >I feel rather dumb. I have a variety of gesso recipes and how to's on >gilding but nothing on the preparation of gum ammoniac. Any hints as to >how to make the stuff sticky, and how long does it keep? Any advice would >be greatly appreciated. If you have the 'rocks' (for lack of a better term) put them in a pan and let them get warm and dissolve in the water, strain it to get out all of the impurities and let it sit for a couple of days so that some of the liquid (water) evaporates off the top. You will have a sticky liquid, gum ammoniac. It can be reconstituted as oft as need be - if you let it sit out too long it will become dry, as any substance will. Just add warm water and stir well. Smiles, Despina - --=====================_2984451==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" At 11:06 AM 11/20/2001 +0000, Isolde the Nimble Fingered wrote:
I feel rather dumb. I have a variety of gesso recipes and how to's on gilding but nothing on the preparation of gum ammoniac. Any hints as to how to make the stuff sticky, and how long does it keep? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

If you have the 'rocks' (for lack of a better term) put them in a pan and let them get warm and dissolve in the water, strain it to get out all of the impurities and let it sit for a couple of days so that some of the liquid (water) evaporates off the top.  You will have a sticky liquid, gum ammoniac.

It can be reconstituted as oft as need be - if you let it sit out too long it will become dry, as any substance will.  Just add warm water and stir well.

Smiles,
Despina - --=====================_2984451==_.ALT-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 09:12:19 -0600 From: "jennet of tewkesbury" Subject: [scribes]: Leaves of Gold & Scribes Seminar Below is a message from Mistress Stephanie of Nethyrwode and may be of interest to any scribes who can make it down to Nashville, TN on Dec 1. It is a non-SCA event, but open to any and all folks interested in coming in for the classes and exhibit, most SCA scribes. :) I got a really dirt cheap flight for the seminar from SouthWest Airlines via the internet. Much cheaper than I could have driven. Jennet Greetings to all, and apologies to those who receive multiple postings. Please feel free to cross post this to interested friends, scribes, and groups. I will be hosting a scribes' seminar on Saturday 12/1/01 at the Frist Center for the Visual Arts in Nashville TN. Classes and discussion on illumination will run from 10 am through 2 pm. Around 2:30 pm we will tour the exhibits "Leaves of Gold" and "Realms of Faith". The tour will be unguided. The museum is open until 5 pm on Saturdays. Admission to the gallery is $5.50/person for adults if you are part of the group, $6.50 if you come on your own. I need to get a general headcount, so if you will be joining us, please contact me privately at Shawn.Reed @ ssa.gov or nethyrwode @ aol.com. Lunch will not be provided, but there is a cafe in the museum and a sandwich shop across the street that should be open. The classes are designed to accommodate hungry artisans. Following the tour, a semi- organized dinner and possible revel will occur. Some limited crash space is available, please contact me privately for more details. Information on hotels and local hotels can be found courtesy of Lady Luca in Grey Niche at www.greyniche.org/scribe/seminar.htm. Please check that site for additional details and updates. Information is also available at the following listserve: ScribesSeminar @ yahoogroups.com In Service, Mst Stephanie of Nethyrwode _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 07:20:54 -0800 From: "SchultzKR" Subject: [scribes]: Re: (scribes): Gum ammoniac This is a multi-part message in MIME format. - ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C17193.E465E9E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Worked with it once and wanted to let you know that if you are going to = be heating it and working with it that it has the most almighly stench = to it - my kitchen was vacated in favor of doing this outside. Warm = your water, put in the crystals (we used the plant itself and gound it = up), let it get quite warm (DO NOT BOIL-this breakes down all of it's = properties and renders it useless), take it off of the stove and let it = get cold before mixing again (straining as necessary) and using. It = will be necessary to heat it again if you need to add more water or use = it again after a long time. Hope this helps - Agatha of Tintagel - ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C17193.E465E9E0 Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Worked with it once and wanted to let = you know that=20 if you are going to be heating it and working with it that it has the = most=20 almighly stench to it - my kitchen was vacated in favor of doing this=20 outside.  Warm your water, put in the crystals (we used the plant = itself=20 and gound it up), let it get quite warm (DO NOT BOIL-this breakes down = all of=20 it's properties and renders it useless), take it off of the stove and = let it get=20 cold before mixing again (straining as necessary) and using.  It = will be=20 necessary to heat it again if you need to add more water or use it again = after a=20 long time.  Hope this helps - Agatha of = Tintagel
- ------=_NextPart_000_0024_01C17193.E465E9E0-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 10:53:35 -0500 From: Dave Nolan/Kara Westfall Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac I just put mine in a little jar, covered the crystals with distilled water, put the lid on, and let it sit for a day. Warming will speed up the process, but it isn't really required. Strain and squeeze through the toe of an old pair of stockings. You can save the lumps and add them to a fresh batch later, or just chuck them. You can tint the liquid red if you want, but I found the color settles out quickly and tends to make it gritty, but YMMV. After you paint it on, let it dry and activate it by breathing on it, just like gesso. Clean your brush with alcohol, if necessary, and be careful that it doesn't dry on your brush and clog it up. I've had good results using it in a dip nib, as well. I've seen some directions that tell you to add alcohol to the crystals instead of water, but I've never tried it, and don't know what the results of this method would be, but I'd guess that it would dry faster when you paint it on. Chiara da Ravenna Stonemarche, East (NH) =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 08:43:05 -0800 (PST) From: Martha Palotay Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac The way I was taught, heating is needed only if you want to speed up the dissolving process. If you have time, it's easiest to just put the crystals in a little jar, add water to cover them, put the lid on the jar, and let the stuff stand for a couple of days. You then shake it up and strain it into another jar. (A piece of pantyhose makes a good strainer.) You'll have to mush the thicker stuff through the strainer, and you may get a bit messy in the process, but it will be a good deal less smelly than if you heated it. (It's still not pleasant-smelling --ever wonder why it's called *ammoniac*?--but at least you won't chase your family out of the house.) HTH, Martha Darach, Caid - --- SchultzKR wrote: > Worked with it once and wanted to let you know that if you are going to be > heating it and working with it that it has the most almighly stench to it - > my kitchen was vacated in favor of doing this outside. Warm your water, put > in the crystals (we used the plant itself and gound it up), let it get quite > warm (DO NOT BOIL-this breakes down all of it's properties and renders it > useless), take it off of the stove and let it get cold before mixing again > (straining as necessary) and using. It will be necessary to heat it again if > you need to add more water or use it again after a long time. Hope this > helps - Agatha of Tintagel > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 09:10:14 -0800 From: "Ken Stoner" Subject: RE: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac To me it is not nearly as unpleasant as old Ox-Gall or Some of the commercial egg tempera's... it smells to me like oatmeal. :-) - -----Original Message----- From: Martha Palotay [mailto:mpalotay@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2001 8:43 AM To: scribes@castle.org Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac The way I was taught, heating is needed only if you want to speed up the dissolving process. If you have time, it's easiest to just put the crystals in a little jar, add water to cover them, put the lid on the jar, and let the stuff stand for a couple of days. You then shake it up and strain it into another jar. (A piece of pantyhose makes a good strainer.) You'll have to mush the thicker stuff through the strainer, and you may get a bit messy in the process, but it will be a good deal less smelly than if you heated it. (It's still not pleasant-smelling --ever wonder why it's called *ammoniac*?--but at least you won't chase your family out of the house.) HTH, Martha Darach, Caid - --- SchultzKR wrote: > Worked with it once and wanted to let you know that if you are going to be > heating it and working with it that it has the most almighly stench to it - > my kitchen was vacated in favor of doing this outside. Warm your water, put > in the crystals (we used the plant itself and gound it up), let it get quite > warm (DO NOT BOIL-this breakes down all of it's properties and renders it > useless), take it off of the stove and let it get cold before mixing again > (straining as necessary) and using. It will be necessary to heat it again if > you need to add more water or use it again after a long time. Hope this > helps - Agatha of Tintagel > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! GeoCities - quick and easy web site hosting, just $8.95/month. http://geocities.yahoo.com/ps/info1 =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 13:01:41 -0600 From: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac Greetings Isolde, You make it sticky bu soaking it in water (preferably distilled) for at least 24 hours. Reggie Ezell suggests microwaving it briefly, but that isn't medieval so I won't bother going through my notes to find out how long. After it's soaked sufficiently, strain it through a fine fabric such as panythose. After the water is out and you start squeezing, the thick stuff like library paste is the part you use. It needs a little more water and s pinch of pigment, usually armenian bole. It keeps a long time in a tightly closed container. If it has mold when you open the container, just skim off the crap before stirring. It may stink like dirty gym socks but it will still work. Corinna - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Isolde the Nimble Fingered" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2001 11:06 AM Subject: [scribes]: Gum ammoniac > I feel rather dumb. I have a variety of gesso recipes and how to's on > gilding but nothing on the preparation of gum ammoniac. Any hints as to how > to make the stuff sticky, and how long does it keep? Any advice would be > greatly appreciated. > > HL Isolde the Nimble Fingered > Kingdom of An Tir > > Per pale sable and argent, an escallop counterchanged. > > Motto: > Tytyvyllus me admittere impellit. > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp > > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 14:05:33 -0500 From: "Jessica Wilbur" Subject: [scribes]: Parchment question Greetings! I'm sure this has been asked before, but I can't seem to find the answer quickly. So I'll ask again - I'm sure the newer folks on the list will benefit as well. ;-) A friend gifted me with a piece of parchment not quite a year ago. Of course, it has remained rolled up since that time, as I wasn't sure what project I was going to use it for. Now I have decided what I'm going to do with it, and I need to know how to flatten it. Should I dampen it and then lay heavy books on it for a while? Is there anything else I need to do to prepare it for taking ink and paint? I'm trying to do this in as period a manner as possible. Thanks in advance! - --Muireann ni Riordain, Barony of Ponte Alto, Atlantia PS. Apologies if some of you received a weird auto-responder email from me in the past two weeks. My significant other took it upon himself to tinker with my email before we left for vacation in Italy. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 20 Nov 2001 16:08:39 -0600 From: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Parchment question Greetings Muireann, Before you do anything else, simply lay it on a table and let it unroll and relax unassisted for a day or two. Corinna - ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jessica Wilbur" To: Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2001 1:05 PM Subject: [scribes]: Parchment question > Greetings! > > I'm sure this has been asked before, but I can't seem to find the > answer quickly. So I'll ask again - I'm sure the newer folks on the > list will benefit as well. ;-) > > A friend gifted me with a piece of parchment not quite a year ago. > Of course, it has remained rolled up since that time, as I wasn't > sure what project I was going to use it for. Now I have decided what > I'm going to do with it, and I need to know how to flatten it. Should I > dampen it and then lay heavy books on it for a while? Is there > anything else I need to do to prepare it for taking ink and paint? I'm > trying to do this in as period a manner as possible. > > Thanks in advance! > --Muireann ni Riordain, > Barony of Ponte Alto, Atlantia > > PS. Apologies if some of you received a weird auto-responder > email from me in the past two weeks. My significant other took it > upon himself to tinker with my email before we left for vacation in > Italy. > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 10:41:09 EST From: RenScribe@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question I used to wet my vellum and tack it to a board to dry....notice I said "used to" :-) A couple of years ago I was preparing a piece of vellum, it was about my 10th piece so I was feeling pretty comfortable with the process. I wet it down and placed long shank tacks around the edge as close as I could get them. About an hour or so later I started hearing strange noises coming from my dining room. The sounds were the tacks bouncing off of my walls. The vellum was so overstretched during processing that it was doing an amazing amount of shrinking. It was actually pulling the tacks out by force. I ended up just throwing a cloth over the top of it for a few days until I thought it was safe to go near it. The vellum had shrunk to about half of its original size. Some of the tacks had been pulled out, others bent and in other spots where the tacks didn't give way, the vellum ripped. Recently I saw a piece done by another scribe where the vellum stayed attached to the board, but the board had warped under the stress of the shrinking vellum. Nowadays I opt for a more passive way of flattening vellum. If it comes rolled, I put it safely on a shelf in the bathroom when I take my shower. It absorbs just a bit of moisture from the air. Then I take it to my desk, lay it flat under a sturdy board and place weight on top. It can take anywhere from a couple of days to months to flatten the vellum this way, so I usually flatten it as soon as I buy it and store it that way rather than rolled. In the past I've had some really crappy vellums. You might as well make it yourself with all of the work that had to go into it. For about the past 5 years all of the vellum I've bought takes little preparation if any. At most all I've had to do is lightly rub it with a pumice stone and pounce it with gum sandarac. Vellum is only scary to work with until you actually experience how much easier it is to work with than paper. The down side is the cost ... and once you try it you're addicted :-) Eibhlin ni Chaoimh AEthelmearc =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 08:17:10 -0800 From: "Ken Stoner" Subject: RE: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question Ditto's and Ahmen to the addiction comment. I am starting to get the shakes and DT's now that we don't have a domestic source for vellum any more... I look at my pile of vellum in the corner and mourn because alas... that is all there is and when it is gone... - -Cystennin the Vellum Addict. - -----Original Message----- From: RenScribe@aol.com [mailto:RenScribe@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2001 7:41 AM To: scribes@castle.org Subject: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question I used to wet my vellum and tack it to a board to dry....notice I said "used to" :-) A couple of years ago I was preparing a piece of vellum, it was about my 10th piece so I was feeling pretty comfortable with the process. I wet it down and placed long shank tacks around the edge as close as I could get them. About an hour or so later I started hearing strange noises coming from my dining room. The sounds were the tacks bouncing off of my walls. The vellum was so overstretched during processing that it was doing an amazing amount of shrinking. It was actually pulling the tacks out by force. I ended up just throwing a cloth over the top of it for a few days until I thought it was safe to go near it. The vellum had shrunk to about half of its original size. Some of the tacks had been pulled out, others bent and in other spots where the tacks didn't give way, the vellum ripped. Recently I saw a piece done by another scribe where the vellum stayed attached to the board, but the board had warped under the stress of the shrinking vellum. Nowadays I opt for a more passive way of flattening vellum. If it comes rolled, I put it safely on a shelf in the bathroom when I take my shower. It absorbs just a bit of moisture from the air. Then I take it to my desk, lay it flat under a sturdy board and place weight on top. It can take anywhere from a couple of days to months to flatten the vellum this way, so I usually flatten it as soon as I buy it and store it that way rather than rolled. In the past I've had some really crappy vellums. You might as well make it yourself with all of the work that had to go into it. For about the past 5 years all of the vellum I've bought takes little preparation if any. At most all I've had to do is lightly rub it with a pumice stone and pounce it with gum sandarac. Vellum is only scary to work with until you actually experience how much easier it is to work with than paper. The down side is the cost ... and once you try it you're addicted :-) Eibhlin ni Chaoimh AEthelmearc =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 11:20:41 EST From: RenScribe@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Re:Gum ammoniac The advice on this topic so far has been wonderful. :-) I just have a couple of extra notes to add If you strain the soaked gum ammoniac through double layers of pantyhose it helps keep the liquid separate from the grainy particles. If you try to squeeze every last bit of liquid through a single layer of pantyhose you might get a bit of material that resembles sticky sand in the bottom of your size. This stuff is extremely sticky and washing you hands, containers or paintbrushes with soap and water doesn't help at all. Use sudsy ammonia or window cleaner. Do not try and build this up to look like gesso. It's supposed to be flat. Test it ... If it is too weak use a couple of thinly applied layers...or If you have time to let it evaporate a bit you will be able to get the same coverage with one application. Placing it on a windowsill or near a heating vent will make this happen a bit quicker. I don't recommend cooking it or putting it in the microwave to speed up the process. When I experimented with this it caused the gum ammoniac liquid to become grainy. A little color added to the size will help you see where you've put it. Red works good under gold leaf, or you can use yellow which will help hide any thin spots in the gold or small mistakes. Blue or gray will do the same under silver leaf. I store mine in old contact lens cases and dry it out before I put the lids on. It only takes a couple of minutes to reconstitute with distilled water. I have kept the same batch this way for the past 4 years. I know other scribes who have kept it as a liquid in a tightly sealed jar in the fridge for at least 5 years without any problems. Eibhlin ni Chaoimh AEthelmearc =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 12:09:11 -0500 From: Randy Asplund Subject: Re: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question You don't have a domestic source for vellum? Who were you getting it from? There are a couple of places with parchment for low rates, and a number who sell at high retail, all in the USA. Exotica for good goatskin, Jesse Meyer in New your for calf, sheep, & goat, and the book binder retail stores who import. A few other hidden sources here and there. One must be careful and ask for samples before ordering. not all suppliers yield good material, and a few have material only good for working on the hair side. RanthulfR Ken Stoner wrote: > > Ditto's and Ahmen to the addiction comment. > > I am starting to get the shakes and DT's now that we don't have a > domestic source for vellum any more... > > I look at my pile of vellum in the corner and mourn because alas... that > is all there is and when it is gone... > > -Cystennin the Vellum Addict. > > -----Original Message----- > From: RenScribe@aol.com [mailto:RenScribe@aol.com] > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2001 7:41 AM > To: scribes@castle.org > Subject: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question > > I used to wet my vellum and tack it to a board to dry....notice I said > "used > to" :-) > > A couple of years ago I was preparing a piece of vellum, it was about my > 10th > piece so I was feeling pretty comfortable with the process. I wet it > down and > placed long shank tacks around the edge as close as I could get them. > About > an hour or so later I started hearing strange noises coming from my > dining > room. The sounds were the tacks bouncing off of my walls. The vellum was > so > overstretched during processing that it was doing an amazing amount of > shrinking. It was actually pulling the tacks out by force. I ended up > just > throwing a cloth over the top of it for a few days until I thought it > was > safe to go near it. The vellum had shrunk to about half of its original > size. > Some of the tacks had been pulled out, others bent and in other spots > where > the tacks didn't give way, the vellum ripped. > > Recently I saw a piece done by another scribe where the vellum stayed > attached to the board, but the board had warped under the stress of the > shrinking vellum. > > Nowadays I opt for a more passive way of flattening vellum. If it comes > rolled, I put it safely on a shelf in the bathroom when I take my > shower. It > absorbs just a bit of moisture from the air. Then I take it to my desk, > lay > it flat under a sturdy board and place weight on top. It can take > anywhere > from a couple of days to months to flatten the vellum this way, so I > usually > flatten it as soon as I buy it and store it that way rather than rolled. > > In the past I've had some really crappy vellums. You might as well make > it > yourself with all of the work that had to go into it. For about the past > 5 > years all of the vellum I've bought takes little preparation if any. At > most > all I've had to do is lightly rub it with a pumice stone and pounce it > with > gum sandarac. > > Vellum is only scary to work with until you actually experience how much > > easier it is to work with than paper. The down side is the cost ... and > once > you try it you're addicted :-) > > Eibhlin ni Chaoimh > AEthelmearc > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. > > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. - -- VISIT RandyAsplund.com To see a Universe of art ranging from Magic: The Gathering to Star Trek and Medieval Manuscripts Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 17:21:18 -0500 From: "Helen Schultz" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Re:Gum ammoniac Eibhlin said about gum ammoniac: > > Do not try and build this up to look like gesso. It's supposed to be flat. I have built it up, but it must be done in MANY layers, with at **LEAST** half an hour (or more) drying time between layers. If you go too fast and too thickly, it will leave an ugly little "river valley" in the middle of your sizing. And, according to Reggie Ezell, if the liquid gum ammoniac gets a little mold on the top, just skim it off and it is still usable. He also said, "If it smells like it is 1,000 years old, then it is just right." KHvS =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2001 23:02:26 EST From: MESTECKLING@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question Do either of these places have websites? Tahnks! Jeannne =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 00:31:57 -0500 From: Randy Asplund Subject: Re: [scribes]: Re:Parchment question For Exotica: Call 732-583-5913 and say you are calling for the Exotica goatskin importers. The last time I spoke with them they had just dropped their regular phone line and had started using the line of another business. I think a concrete business. I spoke with a guy named Carlos. Try www.exoticasa.com Jesse Meyer: mctanner@pioneeris.net 11 Factory St. Montgomery, NY. 12549 Ph: 845-457-3834 Good luck! RanthulfR MESTECKLING@aol.com wrote: > > Do either of these places have websites? > > Tahnks! Jeannne > =================================================================== > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to > with a blank Subject: line and > unsubscribe scribes > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in > the body. - -- VISIT RandyAsplund.com To see a Universe of art ranging from Magic: The Gathering to Star Trek and Medieval Manuscripts Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 22:58:44 +1000 From: "Dani " Subject: [scribes]: "fixing" mistakes Hi all..... After finally getting my paints, finding a suitable practice text, putting lines on the page, sketching in the illumination and even doing the actual calligraphy, I have ruined the whole work with a blot of paint. *sigh* After all the care I took to cover the text, etc.... I opened a new tube of paint to have a splot of it shoot out and a good foot away, right onto the only unprotected spot of the project. Hence my questions - are there any ways to minimize paint mistakes (like splotches) after the fact? Also, are there any ways to correct calligraphy errors? Thanks in advance. Annys ferch Llewellyn (Dani) Lochac - St. Florians =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 22 Nov 2001 08:36:51 EST From: BRNDALSTON@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: "fixing" mistakes - --part1_157.472032f.292e5973_boundary Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/22/2001 8:01:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, destiny@lis.net.au writes: > > Hence my questions - are there any ways to minimize paint mistakes (like > splotches) after the fact? Also, are there any ways to correct calligraphy > errors? > > Sometimes you can correct splotches by turning them into footprints of some critter that you can draw carrying off the letter that got splotched on. If it is in the illumination and not on the calligraphy you can turn the splotch into a squigly - a dot with three or four squigly lines radiating out in each direction - not too many lines or it will look like a sun. Most of the time these squiglies were done in gold. But if you put one in, you will need to make a few more scattered around in the open areas of your illumination. If it is knotwork you might be able to turn it into a zoomorph. Remember, scribes in period had similar accidents and they learned to disguise them because vellum and parchment were too expensive to scrap and start over. I would not try to paint over the splotch using white and then going over the calligraphy again. It is almost impossible to do that and not have it look like it has been fixed. What paper and paint and ink did you use? Sometimes you can very carefully use a damp paper towel to dab most of the paint up and can paint over it, but this is very difficult. Some papers allow you to scrape the fibers of the paper and scrape the paint or ink off but you must be careful not to put a hole in your paper. Good luck! Brandy - --part1_157.472032f.292e5973_boundary Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 11/22/2001 8:01:07 AM Eastern Standard Time, destiny@lis.net.au writes:



Hence my questions - are there any ways to minimize paint mistakes (like
splotches) after the fact? Also, are there any ways to correct calligraphy
errors?



Sometimes you can correct splotches by turning them into footprints of some critter that you can draw carrying off the letter that got splotched on. If it is in the illumination and not on the calligraphy you can turn the splotch into a squigly - a dot with three or four squigly lines radiating out in each direction - not too many lines or it will look like a sun. Most of the time these squiglies were done in gold. But if you put one in, you will need to make a few more scattered around in the open areas of your illumination. If it is knotwork you might be able to turn it into a zoomorph.

Remember, scribes in period had similar accidents and they learned to disguise them because vellum and parchment were too expensive to scrap and start over.

I would not try to paint over the splotch using white and then going over the calligraphy again. It is almost impossible to do that and not have it look like it has been fixed.

What paper and paint and ink did you use? Sometimes you can very carefully use a damp paper towel to dab most of the paint up and can paint over it, but this is very difficult. Some papers allow you to scrape the fibers of the paper and scrape the paint or ink off but you must be careful not to put a hole in your paper.

Good luck!
Brandy - --part1_157.472032f.292e5973_boundary-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V7 #40 ****************************