From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest)
To: scribes-digest@castle.org
Subject: scribes digest V7 #11
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scribes digest       Monday, September 24 2001       Volume 07 : Number 011



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 Re: [scribes]: new tools
 Re: [scribes]: Erasers
 Re: [scribes]: Erasers
 [scribes]: query on templates
 [scribes]: more quill issues
 [scribes]: Quill curing
 Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic
 Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic
 Re: [scribes]: Silverpoint
 [scribes]: New to list
 RE: [scribes]: New to list
 Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic
 Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic
 Re: [scribes]: e-publishing (was Arthurian Heraldry)
 Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic

----------------------------------------------------------------------

Date: Sat, 22 Sep 2001 21:26:12 -0500
From: "Helen Schultz" <meisterin@comteck.com>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: new tools

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Sarra:

If you start with the Mitchell nibs, you need to boil them for about 1 =
minute each (best done separately rather than as a group) and then =
quickly pass the nib through a candle flame to re-temper them (I hold =
mine with a pair of tweezers to do this).  I also use a hand-held sieve =
to boil the nib in the water, allows you to easily remove the nib.  This =
is done to remove the lacquer placed on the nib for shipping.  I like to =
use the Mitchell nibs best, without the little reservoir.  It is a =
learned thing, so play around with all your new nibs to find which you =
like the best.  I don't know if the Brause nibs also need to be boiled, =
as I've not used mine yet.  I do like the Brause EF-66 and it becomes =
wonderfully flexible when boiled and re-tempered.

I just gave a friend some advice on how to train your hand to be =
lighter.  Try this and see if it helps.  Get some of the =
non-reproducible grid practice paper (comes in 11" x 17" pads) that is =
8:1 in ratio (that is 8 squares to an inch).  Use each set of 8 squares =
(or one inch square) as a basis for Roman monoline capitals.  Using a =
very hard lead, draw each letter in one of the inch squares... usually, =
only the A, O, M, W are the full width, all the other letters will vary =
according to its own relationship.  When you draw these letters, try to =
make your pencil lines as light as you can and yet still see them.  =
After a while, you will learn not to hold that pencil or pen so tightly, =
and you will also gain a lighter pen stroke in the end when you need it. =
 This takes a little practice, so don't expect it to work right away.  =
You have to teach your hand to "lighten up." <grin>

KHvS
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Floriligeum@aol.com=20
  To: scribes@castle.org=20
  Sent: Saturday, September 22, 2001 12:16 AM
  Subject: [scribes]: new tools


  I just received a box of goodies.  I was lucky enough to get a gift of =
spending $ for the Paper & Ink catalog and today my package arrived!  =20

  I have a set of 10 new Mitchell Rexel nibs, and some Brause nibs as =
well as a few different nib holders, so now I can start to break my =
addiction to the Rotring cartridge pens.  And can start to try the =
advice you all shared with me on colored "inks."  =20

  Trying to keep this post on topic, I am wondering which nibs you all =
think I should start with.  The nibs on the Rotring are VERY stiff and I =
tend to hold my pen with what has been called the "death grip."  I am =
hoping to eventually be able to move toward making & using quills, but I =
think at this point I would kill them. (I have visions of the split =
traveling up the shaft of the quill.)  So until I learn some better =
control, which nibs should I start with?  (I also got one Hiro nib, but =
that one is really tiny, and I don't expect to use it for anything but =
detail work.)=20

  Thanks for all your help so far.=20


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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Sarra:</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>If you start with the Mitchell nibs, =
you need to=20
boil them for about 1 minute each (best done separately rather than as a =
group)=20
and then quickly pass the nib through a candle flame to re-temper them =
(I hold=20
mine with a pair of tweezers to do this).&nbsp; I also use a hand-held =
sieve to=20
boil the nib in the water, allows you to easily remove the nib.&nbsp; =
This is=20
done to remove the lacquer placed on the nib for shipping.&nbsp; I like =
to use=20
the Mitchell nibs best, without the little reservoir.&nbsp; It is a =
learned=20
thing, so play around with all your new nibs to find which you like the=20
best.&nbsp; I don't know if the Brause nibs also need to be boiled, as =
I've not=20
used mine yet.&nbsp; I do like the Brause EF-66 and it becomes =
wonderfully=20
flexible when boiled and re-tempered.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>I just gave a friend some advice on how =
to train=20
your hand to be lighter.&nbsp; Try this and see if it helps.&nbsp; Get =
some of=20
the non-reproducible grid practice paper (comes in 11" x 17" pads) that =
is 8:1=20
in ratio (that is 8 squares to an inch).&nbsp; Use each set of 8 squares =
(or one=20
inch square) as a basis for Roman monoline capitals.&nbsp; Using a very =
hard=20
lead, draw each letter in one of the inch squares... usually, only the =
A, O, M,=20
W are the full width, all the other letters will vary according to its =
own=20
relationship.&nbsp; When you draw these letters, try to make your pencil =
lines=20
as light as you can and yet still see them.&nbsp; After a while, you =
will learn=20
not to hold that pencil or pen so tightly, and you will also gain a =
lighter pen=20
stroke in the end when you need it.&nbsp; This takes&nbsp;a little =
practice, so=20
don't expect it to work right away.&nbsp; You have to teach your hand to =

"lighten up." &lt;grin&gt;</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>KHvS</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=3DFloriligeum@aol.com=20
  href=3D"mailto:Floriligeum@aol.com">Floriligeum@aol.com</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dscribes@castle.org=20
  href=3D"mailto:scribes@castle.org">scribes@castle.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, September 22, =
2001 12:16=20
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> [scribes]: new =
tools</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT lang=3D0 =
face=3D"Goudy Old Style"=20
  size=3D3 FAMILY=3D"SERIF">I just received a box of goodies. &nbsp;I =
was lucky=20
  enough to get a gift of spending $ for the Paper &amp; Ink catalog and =
today=20
  my package arrived! &nbsp; <BR><BR>I have a set of 10 new Mitchell =
Rexel nibs,=20
  and some Brause nibs as well as a few different nib holders, so now I =
can=20
  start to break my addiction to the Rotring cartridge pens. &nbsp;And =
can start=20
  to try the advice you all shared with me on colored "inks." &nbsp;=20
  <BR><BR>Trying to keep this post on topic, I am wondering which nibs =
you all=20
  think I should start with. &nbsp;The nibs on the Rotring are VERY =
stiff and I=20
  tend to hold my pen with what has been called the "death grip." =
&nbsp;I am=20
  hoping to eventually be able to move toward making &amp; using quills, =
but I=20
  think at this point I would kill them. (I have visions of the split =
traveling=20
  up the shaft of the quill.) &nbsp;So until I learn some better =
control, which=20
  nibs should I start with? &nbsp;(I also got one Hiro nib, but that one =
is=20
  really tiny, and I don't expect to use it for anything but detail =
work.)=20
  <BR><BR>Thanks for all your help so far.=20
<BR></FONT></FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2001 09:03:08 EDT
From: BRNDALSTON@aol.com
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Erasers

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In a message dated 9/22/2001 4:19:50 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
uncial@ix.netcom.com writes:


> Brandy, thank you for the explanation.  I was using a commercially prepared 
> silverpoint paper.  I had once been told that it was the texture of the 
> gesso that pulled tiny bits of silver onto it, rather like sandpaper, but 
> this stuff is very smooth.  Chemistry makes a lot more sense.
>  
> I use zinc as a nutritional supplement.  Will powdering one of the pills 
> work or do I need to buy it from a scientific supply shop?
> 

I am not sure if zinc pills will work or not. I got my zinc powder from 
Baroness Annejka when she taught the class on Silverpoint at our scribal 
event last February. All I can say is try it and let us know how it turns 
out. There may be other additives in the zinc pills that might not be so good 
on your scroll. I really have no idea.

Brandy

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<HTML><FONT FACE=arial,helvetica><FONT  SIZE=2>In a message dated 9/22/2001 4:19:50 AM Eastern Daylight Time, uncial@ix.netcom.com writes:
<BR>
<BR>
<BR><BLOCKQUOTE TYPE=CITE style="BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px">Brandy, thank you for the explanation. &nbsp;I was using a commercially prepared silverpoint paper. &nbsp;I had once been told that it was the texture of the gesso that pulled tiny bits of silver onto it, rather like sandpaper, but this stuff is very smooth. &nbsp;Chemistry makes a lot more sense.
<BR> 
<BR>I use zinc as a nutritional supplement. &nbsp;Will powdering one of the pills work or do I need to buy it from a scientific supply shop?
<BR></BLOCKQUOTE>
<BR>
<BR>I am not sure if zinc pills will work or not. I got my zinc powder from Baroness Annejka when she taught the class on Silverpoint at our scribal event last February. All I can say is try it and let us know how it turns out. There may be other additives in the zinc pills that might not be so good on your scroll. I really have no idea.
<BR>
<BR>Brandy</FONT></HTML>

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2001 10:47:45 -0500
From: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" <uncial@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Erasers

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

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Thank you Brandy.
By the way, it wasn't a scroll.  It was homework for Reggie Ezell's =
class, which is quite possibly the world's best mundane calligraphy =
course.  This was an excercise in drawn Roman caps, our chyoice of text =
and medium.

Corinna

  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: BRNDALSTON@aol.com=20
  To: scribes@castle.org=20
  Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2001 8:03 AM
  Subject: Re: [scribes]: Erasers


  In a message dated 9/22/2001 4:19:50 AM Eastern Daylight Time, =
uncial@ix.netcom.com writes:=20



    Brandy, thank you for the explanation.  I was using a commercially =
prepared silverpoint paper.  I had once been told that it was the =
texture of the gesso that pulled tiny bits of silver onto it, rather =
like sandpaper, but this stuff is very smooth.  Chemistry makes a lot =
more sense.=20

    I use zinc as a nutritional supplement.  Will powdering one of the =
pills work or do I need to buy it from a scientific supply shop?=20



  I am not sure if zinc pills will work or not. I got my zinc powder =
from Baroness Annejka when she taught the class on Silverpoint at our =
scribal event last February. All I can say is try it and let us know how =
it turns out. There may be other additives in the zinc pills that might =
not be so good on your scroll. I really have no idea.=20

  Brandy=20

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<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=3DContent-Type content=3D"text/html; =
charset=3Diso-8859-1">
<META content=3D"MSHTML 5.50.4611.1300" name=3DGENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=3D#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Thank you Brandy.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>By the way, it wasn't a scroll.&nbsp; =
It was=20
homework for Reggie Ezell's class, which is quite possibly the world's =
best=20
mundane calligraphy course.&nbsp; This was an excercise in drawn Roman =
caps, our=20
chyoice of text and medium.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=3DArial size=3D2>Corinna</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=3DBRNDALSTON@aol.com=20
  href=3D"mailto:BRNDALSTON@aol.com">BRNDALSTON@aol.com</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A =
title=3Dscribes@castle.org=20
  href=3D"mailto:scribes@castle.org">scribes@castle.org</A> </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, September 23, =
2001 8:03=20
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [scribes]: =
Erasers</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV><FONT face=3Darial,helvetica><FONT size=3D2>In a =
message dated=20
  9/22/2001 4:19:50 AM Eastern Daylight Time, <A=20
  href=3D"mailto:uncial@ix.netcom.com">uncial@ix.netcom.com</A> writes:=20
  <BR><BR><BR>
  <BLOCKQUOTE=20
  style=3D"PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #0000ff 2px =
solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"=20
  TYPE=3D"CITE">Brandy, thank you for the explanation. &nbsp;I was using =
a=20
    commercially prepared silverpoint paper. &nbsp;I had once been told =
that it=20
    was the texture of the gesso that pulled tiny bits of silver onto =
it, rather=20
    like sandpaper, but this stuff is very smooth. &nbsp;Chemistry makes =
a lot=20
    more sense. <BR><BR>I use zinc as a nutritional supplement. =
&nbsp;Will=20
    powdering one of the pills work or do I need to buy it from a =
scientific=20
    supply shop? <BR></BLOCKQUOTE><BR><BR>I am not sure if zinc pills =
will work or=20
  not. I got my zinc powder from Baroness Annejka when she taught the =
class on=20
  Silverpoint at our scribal event last February. All I can say is try =
it and=20
  let us know how it turns out. There may be other additives in the zinc =
pills=20
  that might not be so good on your scroll. I really have no idea.=20
  <BR><BR>Brandy</FONT> </FONT></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>

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------------------------------

Date: Sun, 23 Sep 2001 09:53:42 -0700
From: "Dr Donna DeBonis" <drdonna@pioneernet.net>
Subject: [scribes]: query on templates

Greetings to the List,
I am new on this List and I come to you with a plea for help.

I apologise in advance for asking for pre-made templates...however...
I need to make about 20 'prize scrolls' for a tournament . The person who
was going to give me some scroll templates is involved with a funeral
preparation and has not been able to email the templates to me.
Thus I come to this List seeking templates that I can use my color printer
to print out onto parchemnt colored resume paper in order to make 'scroll
stationery'.  At that point I will run the stationery into the printer
again, this time imprinting the specific text for the 'prize'.

If anyone can email me a downloadable ready-to-imprint template , I would be
forever grateful.



In service to the SCA Equestrian Dream,
THL Donwenna
****************************************************************************
************
*Apprentice to Visc Sir Raphael the Rogue, OL, (sirrapheal@hotmail.com)
*New IKEqC website:  http://SCAIKEQC.homestead.com/introduction.html
*Donwenna's SCA  EQ info  http://THLDonwenna.homestead.com/index.html
*and www.joustabout.com for Professional jousting entertainment
* The Clinic  www.animalhospitalonmidway.com
****************************************************************************
******************


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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 08:37:13 -0500
From: "Margareta vanden Velde" <margareta@skraeling.sca.org>
Subject: [scribes]: more quill issues

    I got a weird batch of quills (goose) from a friend.  I've cut a few
quill pens now with different birds, but the feathers in this batch seem
simultaneously too brittle and too soft.  That is, the tips are really
wiggly, and yet when I go to cut them they want to shatter and crack all the
way up the barrel.  I've never had any problems before, does anyone know
what is happening here?  These quills are between six months and one year
old.

    Of course this happened in a "Scribing without Fear" class where I was
trying to show everyone how EASY quill pens were to make.  Sigh.

    Any comments happily accepted.  I'd hate to throw out all the quills.

    Margareta vanden Velde
    Barony of Skraeling Althing, Ealdormere
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------
Gules, three sparks inverted and a bordure engrailed Or.

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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 09:05:03 -0500
From: Janice Safran <jks6@cornell.edu>
Subject: [scribes]: Quill curing

>Can someone talk a little bit more about the
>curing process?


I put together a PDF file on curing methods. It's one of my first 
bits of research, so it reads like a VCR instruction manual : )  but 
it should give anyone interested in curing the basics

Jan

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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 08:11:27 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" <hughesjp@fyi.net>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic

There is a book called Fantastic Heraldry (Sorry, I don't remember the
author) that lists arms that were attributed to all kinds of people (ie,
Adam, God, King Arthur, etc.).  The attributed arms are probably from Le
Morte d'Artur, which was written during a period when heraldry was *very*
important.

Graidhne ni Ruaidh, QHG (Qualified Herald Geek)

On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Corinna Taylor/Al Frank wrote:

> Greetings all.
> 
> A friend contacted me today to request help with his son's resesarch for a school project drawing the arms of the Knights of the Round Table.
> 
> After telling him that 1) they were fictitious and 2) several hundred years before the development of a formal system of heraldry, I recommended Sir Arthur Fox-Davies Encyclopedia of Heraldry (I'm not sure of the exact title, but I mean the huge book, not the Dover reprint of selected pages) or other basic guide to heraldry, and simply read the various accepted versions such as Mallory for descriptions.
> 
> If anyone has other ideas, especially book titles, I would be happy to pass them along to my friend.  He is not on the internet, though I assume his son has access through his school or library.
> 
> Corinna
> Midrealm
> 

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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 08:15:05 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" <hughesjp@fyi.net>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic

Correction to my post; Lyle is correct about both title and
author.  (Well, I'm an *old* heraldic geek, and I was having a senior
moment...)

Graidhne

On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Lyle H. Gray wrote:

> See if anyone in your area has a copy of Alfgar the Sententious's
> _Fabulous Heraldry_, a collection of arms, devices and badges
> attributed to fictional, legendary, and traditionaly figures.
> Several members of the Round Table were given attributed arms at
> later dates.
> 
> For example, Arthur was attributed arms of _Azure, three crowns
> [in pale] or_, _Gules, three crowns [in pale] or_, and _Azure,
> thirteen crowns or_, as well as others, in different texts.
> 
> Lyle FitzWilliam
> 
> On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Corinna Taylor/Al Frank wrote:
> 
> > Greetings all.
> >
> > A friend contacted me today to request help with his son's
> > resesarch for a school project drawing the arms of the
> > Knights of the Round Table.
> >
> > After telling him that 1) they were fictitious and 2) several
> > hundred years before the development of a formal system of
> > heraldry, I recommended Sir Arthur Fox-Davies Encyclopedia of
> > Heraldry (I'm not sure of the exact title, but I mean the
> > huge book, not the Dover reprint of selected pages) or other
> > basic guide to heraldry, and simply read the various accepted
> > versions such as Mallory for descriptions.
> >
> > If anyone has other ideas, especially book titles, I would be
> > happy to pass them along to my friend.  He is not on the
> > internet, though I assume his son has access through his
> > school or library.
> >
> > Corinna
> > Midrealm
> >
> 
> ===================================================================
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> with a blank Subject: line and
> unsubscribe scribes
> in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in
> the body.
> 
> 

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 07:08:12 -0700 (PDT)
From: Suzanne Powell <suzanne_powell@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Silverpoint

Greetings, Brandy!

I'm very interested in learning Silverpoint.  Do you have Baroness Annejka's
contact information (or could you ask her to contact me)?

Thank you for your assistance.

- -- Suzanne

- --- BRNDALSTON@aol.com wrote:
> In a message dated 9/22/2001 4:19:50 AM Eastern Daylight Time, 
> uncial@ix.netcom.com writes:
> 
> 
> > Brandy, thank you for the explanation.  I was using a commercially prepared
> 
> > silverpoint paper.  I had once been told that it was the texture of the 
> > gesso that pulled tiny bits of silver onto it, rather like sandpaper, but 
> > this stuff is very smooth.  Chemistry makes a lot more sense.
> >  
> > I use zinc as a nutritional supplement.  Will powdering one of the pills 
> > work or do I need to buy it from a scientific supply shop?
> > 
> 
> I am not sure if zinc pills will work or not. I got my zinc powder from 
> Baroness Annejka when she taught the class on Silverpoint at our scribal 
> event last February. All I can say is try it and let us know how it turns 
> out. There may be other additives in the zinc pills that might not be so good
> 
> on your scroll. I really have no idea.
> 
> Brandy
> 




=====
HL Suzanne de la Ferté  
Stargate/Westgate, Kingdom of Ansteorra
- ------------------------------------------------------------
Suzanne C. Powell                            Houston, Texas 
                                   suzanne_powell@yahoo.com

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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 10:15:21 EDT
From: MESTECKLING@aol.com
Subject: [scribes]: New to list

Hi all - 
I'm new to the list, and a very inexperienced scribe from Caer Galen, 
Outlands.  After years of trying to do callig I've finally just given it up 
and usually hand in blank scrolls, unless it's celtic, which I can do.

From what I've read so far the focus of this list might be a little advanced 
for my abilities, but thought I'd throw a question or two out there.  The 
first has to do with portraiture. (sp?)  Basically looking for any hints, 
books or sites that can help with that.  I can draw faces well, even do 
pretty well with water colors, but when I get to gouaches they all look like 
cabbage patch kids!  I appreciate any hints at all.

Thanks!
Jeanne Dyfrigi
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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 06:57:24 -0700
From: "Anne of Bradford" <rdwlist@att.net>
Subject: RE: [scribes]: New to list

<<Snip from Jeanne>>
From what I've read so far the focus of this list might be a little advanced
for my abilities, >>

As someone who's done calligraphy for years, but never for the SCA seriously
before a couple of years ago (even though I've been in the SCA for over 20
years), the range of experience levels varies as greatly as does the range
of interests.  We've got everyone from those who can discuss the various
chemical interactions between period pigment materials to people like me who
really get a lot out of the discussions of inks and pens, and what gouaches
are good for beginning limners to start with.  Advanced?  No.  Full of
people who are advanced and willing to help anyone who asks?  Yes!

As for a consistent focus?  I'd say the only consistency is the
self-improvement that we're all looking for.  Those who are very experienced
in one area of the SCA scribal arts may well have serious limitations in
another. This is one of the best, IMHO, of the SCA lists for encouragement,
serious scholarship and people who are just friendly.  Maybe it's that we're
really an artsy service for the SCA.  Service oriented people tend to want
to attract others - if only to spread the workload <grin>.

Have confidence that you're not alone in feeling awed sometimes at the
knowledge or passion level of the discussions.  Don't let it scare you away.
I'm kind of fascinated by it.

Still learning and always will be,

VM Anne of Bradford, StellarNordica Scribe, Oertha

ps.  Think podlings from "Dark Crystal" for me.  That's about where my
drawing capabilities are.


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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 10:36:41 -0500
From: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" <uncial@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic

Greetings Lyle and Cecilia,

Would I be correct in assuming that Alfgar is a SCA member and this book
might not be readily available through Amazon et al?  Where would I find it?
I'm not currently active in SCA.

Corinna

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" <hughesjp@fyi.net>
To: "Lyle H. Gray" <gray@cs.umass.edu>
Cc: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" <uncial@ix.netcom.com>; "Scribes"
<scribes@castle.org>
Sent: Monday, September 24, 2001 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic


> Correction to my post; Lyle is correct about both title and
> author.  (Well, I'm an *old* heraldic geek, and I was having a senior
> moment...)
>
> Graidhne
>
> On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Lyle H. Gray wrote:
>
> > See if anyone in your area has a copy of Alfgar the Sententious's
> > _Fabulous Heraldry_, a collection of arms, devices and badges
> > attributed to fictional, legendary, and traditionaly figures.
> > Several members of the Round Table were given attributed arms at
> > later dates.
> >
> > For example, Arthur was attributed arms of _Azure, three crowns
> > [in pale] or_, _Gules, three crowns [in pale] or_, and _Azure,
> > thirteen crowns or_, as well as others, in different texts.
> >
> > Lyle FitzWilliam
> >
> > On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Corinna Taylor/Al Frank wrote:
> >
> > > Greetings all.
> > >
> > > A friend contacted me today to request help with his son's
> > > resesarch for a school project drawing the arms of the
> > > Knights of the Round Table.
> > >
> > > After telling him that 1) they were fictitious and 2) several
> > > hundred years before the development of a formal system of
> > > heraldry, I recommended Sir Arthur Fox-Davies Encyclopedia of
> > > Heraldry (I'm not sure of the exact title, but I mean the
> > > huge book, not the Dover reprint of selected pages) or other
> > > basic guide to heraldry, and simply read the various accepted
> > > versions such as Mallory for descriptions.
> > >
> > > If anyone has other ideas, especially book titles, I would be
> > > happy to pass them along to my friend.  He is not on the
> > > internet, though I assume his son has access through his
> > > school or library.
> > >
> > > Corinna
> > > Midrealm
> > >
> >
> > ===================================================================
> > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to <majordomo@castle.org>
> > with a blank Subject: line and
> > unsubscribe scribes
> > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in
> > the body.
> >
> >
>

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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 10:35:01 -0500
From: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" <uncial@ix.netcom.com>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic

Thank you, Graidhne,
It's too late for my friend, though I found him a bunch of other stuff
(thanks all who responded!).  But it's not too late for me.  Sounds like a
great book for me if I can find it for a reasonable price.

Corinna

- ----- Original Message -----
From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" <hughesjp@fyi.net>
To: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" <uncial@ix.netcom.com>
Cc: "Scribes" <scribes@castle.org>
Sent: Monday, September 24, 2001 7:11 AM
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic


> There is a book called Fantastic Heraldry (Sorry, I don't remember the
> author) that lists arms that were attributed to all kinds of people (ie,
> Adam, God, King Arthur, etc.).  The attributed arms are probably from Le
> Morte d'Artur, which was written during a period when heraldry was *very*
> important.
>
> Graidhne ni Ruaidh, QHG (Qualified Herald Geek)
>
> On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Corinna Taylor/Al Frank wrote:
>
> > Greetings all.
> >
> > A friend contacted me today to request help with his son's resesarch for
a school project drawing the arms of the Knights of the Round Table.
> >
> > After telling him that 1) they were fictitious and 2) several hundred
years before the development of a formal system of heraldry, I recommended
Sir Arthur Fox-Davies Encyclopedia of Heraldry (I'm not sure of the exact
title, but I mean the huge book, not the Dover reprint of selected pages) or
other basic guide to heraldry, and simply read the various accepted versions
such as Mallory for descriptions.
> >
> > If anyone has other ideas, especially book titles, I would be happy to
pass them along to my friend.  He is not on the internet, though I assume
his son has access through his school or library.
> >
> > Corinna
> > Midrealm
> >
>

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Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 11:05:42 -0500 (EST)
From: john j cash <jcash@indiana.edu>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: e-publishing (was Arthurian Heraldry)

Dear folks,

This thread raised the question in my mind: couldn't the SCA get a list of
these SCA-produced publications together, reprint them through the TI
office, and put together a package for one of the electronic book-sellers
to offer? As an alternative, couldn't the SCA organize a digitalization
project for some of these publications, and put them on the Web as a
collection of files accessed through our sites?

- -- johannes v.n.

On Mon, 24 Sep 2001, Corinna Taylor/Al Frank wrote:

> Greetings Lyle and Cecilia,
> 
> Would I be correct in assuming that Alfgar is a SCA member and this book
> might not be readily available through Amazon et al?  Where would I find it?
> I'm not currently active in SCA.
> 
> Corinna
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" <hughesjp@fyi.net>
> To: "Lyle H. Gray" <gray@cs.umass.edu>
> Cc: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" <uncial@ix.netcom.com>; "Scribes"
> <scribes@castle.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2001 7:15 AM
> Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic
> 
> 
> > Correction to my post; Lyle is correct about both title and
> > author.  (Well, I'm an *old* heraldic geek, and I was having a senior
> > moment...)
> >
> > Graidhne
> >
> > On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Lyle H. Gray wrote:
> >
> > > See if anyone in your area has a copy of Alfgar the Sententious's
> > > _Fabulous Heraldry_, a collection of arms, devices and badges
> > > attributed to fictional, legendary, and traditionaly figures.
> > > Several members of the Round Table were given attributed arms at
> > > later dates.
> > >
> > > For example, Arthur was attributed arms of _Azure, three crowns
> > > [in pale] or_, _Gules, three crowns [in pale] or_, and _Azure,
> > > thirteen crowns or_, as well as others, in different texts.
> > >
> > > Lyle FitzWilliam
> > >
> > > On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Corinna Taylor/Al Frank wrote:
> > >
> > > > Greetings all.
> > > >
> > > > A friend contacted me today to request help with his son's
> > > > resesarch for a school project drawing the arms of the
> > > > Knights of the Round Table.
> > > >
> > > > After telling him that 1) they were fictitious and 2) several
> > > > hundred years before the development of a formal system of
> > > > heraldry, I recommended Sir Arthur Fox-Davies Encyclopedia of
> > > > Heraldry (I'm not sure of the exact title, but I mean the
> > > > huge book, not the Dover reprint of selected pages) or other
> > > > basic guide to heraldry, and simply read the various accepted
> > > > versions such as Mallory for descriptions.
> > > >
> > > > If anyone has other ideas, especially book titles, I would be
> > > > happy to pass them along to my friend.  He is not on the
> > > > internet, though I assume his son has access through his
> > > > school or library.
> > > >
> > > > Corinna
> > > > Midrealm
> > > >
> > >
> > > ===================================================================
> > > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to <majordomo@castle.org>
> > > with a blank Subject: line and
> > > unsubscribe scribes
> > > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in
> > > the body.
> > >
> > >
> >
> 
> ===================================================================
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> with a blank Subject: line and
> unsubscribe scribes
> in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in
> the body.
> 
> 

"If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to be a horrible         
warning." -- Cathering Aird

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------------------------------

Date: Mon, 24 Sep 2001 11:55:14 -0400 (EDT)
From: "Lyle H. Gray" <gray@cs.umass.edu>
Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic

On Mon, 24 Sep 2001, Corinna Taylor/Al Frank wrote:

> Greetings Lyle and Cecilia,
>
> Would I be correct in assuming that Alfgar is a SCA member and this book
> might not be readily available through Amazon et al?  Where would I find it?
> I'm not currently active in SCA.
>
> Corinna

You know, it's been so long since I obtained my copy, that I
can't remember exactly _where_ I got it.  The inside cover has a
sticker for "Merlin's Closet" in Providence, RI, but I don't know
whether that bookseller is still around, or if the book would
still be carried.

Yes, Alfgar is an SCA member, and this book was self-published in
1976 for sale within the SCA (my copy is stapled together).  It
would not be available through Amazon.

Lyle FitzWilliam

>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" <hughesjp@fyi.net>
> To: "Lyle H. Gray" <gray@cs.umass.edu>
> Cc: "Corinna Taylor/Al Frank" <uncial@ix.netcom.com>; "Scribes"
> <scribes@castle.org>
> Sent: Monday, September 24, 2001 7:15 AM
> Subject: Re: [scribes]: Arthurian Heraldry - off-topic
>
>
> > Correction to my post; Lyle is correct about both title and
> > author.  (Well, I'm an *old* heraldic geek, and I was having a senior
> > moment...)
> >
> > Graidhne
> >
> > On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Lyle H. Gray wrote:
> >
> > > See if anyone in your area has a copy of Alfgar the Sententious's
> > > _Fabulous Heraldry_, a collection of arms, devices and badges
> > > attributed to fictional, legendary, and traditionaly figures.
> > > Several members of the Round Table were given attributed arms at
> > > later dates.
> > >
> > > For example, Arthur was attributed arms of _Azure, three crowns
> > > [in pale] or_, _Gules, three crowns [in pale] or_, and _Azure,
> > > thirteen crowns or_, as well as others, in different texts.
> > >
> > > Lyle FitzWilliam
> > >
> > > On Fri, 21 Sep 2001, Corinna Taylor/Al Frank wrote:
> > >
> > > > Greetings all.
> > > >
> > > > A friend contacted me today to request help with his son's
> > > > resesarch for a school project drawing the arms of the
> > > > Knights of the Round Table.
> > > >
> > > > After telling him that 1) they were fictitious and 2) several
> > > > hundred years before the development of a formal system of
> > > > heraldry, I recommended Sir Arthur Fox-Davies Encyclopedia of
> > > > Heraldry (I'm not sure of the exact title, but I mean the
> > > > huge book, not the Dover reprint of selected pages) or other
> > > > basic guide to heraldry, and simply read the various accepted
> > > > versions such as Mallory for descriptions.
> > > >
> > > > If anyone has other ideas, especially book titles, I would be
> > > > happy to pass them along to my friend.  He is not on the
> > > > internet, though I assume his son has access through his
> > > > school or library.
> > > >
> > > > Corinna
> > > > Midrealm
> > > >
> > >
> > > ===================================================================
> > > To unsubscribe from this list, send email to <majordomo@castle.org>
> > > with a blank Subject: line and
> > > unsubscribe scribes
> > > in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in
> > > the body.
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>

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End of scribes digest V7 #11
****************************