From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V5 #86 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Friday, March 16 2001 Volume 05 : Number 086 ======================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with unsubscribe scribes-digets in the body of the message. Leave the subject line blank. Do not include any additional text. RE: [scribes]: scrolls backlogs RE: [scribes]: scrolls backlogs ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 16:28:21 -0500 From: "PRW" Subject: RE: [scribes]: scrolls backlogs Gentle Lady and good scribes all.. There is, indeed, a vast difference in how scribes do their work and how the office of the signet in various kingdoms handle "scrolls." I have lived in two separate kingdoms, and the methods of handling them are as different as night and day. In Atlantia, for instance, an Armigerous scroll is not given out in court unless the recipient has actually had a Device registered via the college of Heralds. Sometimes a promissory is given, sometimes not. In Aethelmearc, the custom is to leave a space for the Blazon if the Arms have not yet been registered, as well as an Escutcheon or Rondel (blank) for the image to be later filled in. In Atlantia, is not unknown for awards to be decided upon the very day of Court.. (the Shark's Tooth, for example is given for bravery and prowess on a given day that the Monarchs feel worthy of note) where in Aethelmearc, most of the awards are "orders" and many decisions for the bestowal of them are made well in advance of the actual date, giving lead-times of MONTHS to the scribes to handle the work. Both of these Kingdoms came from the same "base" culture of the EastRealm, and while are also neighboring lands, the beliefs and customs surrounding awards and scrolls are vastly different. Neither is "right" or "wrong," but it is simply how things are done. Some customs lead to backlogs,.. some do not. On the otherhand, this also leads to an "expectation" of scrolls to be awarded in Court by the populace. While that is both good and bad.. I think, perhaps, the vast talent that I have seen going into these scrolls becomes undervalued. When the general populace sees 11-20 scrolls, every weekend, all of remarkable or higher caliber being handed out, new scribes can feel overwhelmed at the task and so shy away, experienced scribes can quickly burn out, as their work is "expected" and the populace can become jaded to the absolute amount of beauty and effort involved in these scrolls. So.. each 'culture' has benefits and pitfalls, that we, as scribes, face every day. To my humble mind, any scroll, done by any scribe, for any Kingdom is a gift to our Society in general and the efforts of the scribe deserve praise. As always, I remain, In Service to the Dream. Syr Malcolm MacEoghainn.. Aethelmearc. > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-scribes@castle.org [mailto:owner-scribes@castle.org]On > Behalf Of abbondanza > Sent: Friday, March 16, 2001 9:41 AM > To: scribes@castle.org > Subject: Re: [scribes]: scrolls backlogs > > > Gracious Lady, > > I found your missive fascinating but I have a few questions of > my own to pose which is related to this issue. > I would like to know why a Kingdom's backlog exists? from their > perspective? > Is a recipient expected to find their own scribe and commission > their work? > Did the scribe drop out of the sca with ~unfinished business? > Was their a communication misfire or misunderstanding? > What do other kingdom's assignment procedures consist of? > Do all Kingdoms have a Backlog Officer who a recipient may go to > and say, "Gee, Its been a year and I still don't have my > scroll". > Is there a lack of support to the scribal communities elsewhere > in the Known World? > Is the responsibility/role clearly defined to everyone involved? > How many scribes paint v how many active members in a Kingdom? > Is there a turnover rate of scribes in a Kingdom? (burn out) > How do other kingdom's recruit scribes? > > I have been painting for Aethelemarc for 2+ years, I have 1000 > hours logged in as painting time, I just finished my 37th scroll > last night. I also painted two peerages which were sent to the > West Kingdom last year and were well received. The King of the > West actually came to the Aethelmearc Scribal tea at the Pennsic > War last year to ~personally~ thank each scribe who sent work to > the West. I will always remember this with great fondness, it > was > a huge learning experience, the West does things differently > than we do, a bit of culture shock. However, Mistress Gierny had > written up Our roles clearly so that we understood exactly what > we needed to do and when I had questions she answered them > promptly. It was a great experience to learn how others have to > paint within a canon of expectation. > > In Aethelmearc, scribes are adored and treated well, not just by > recipients but by everyone, but most importantly by Our Chief > of Scribes (Sylvan Signet) THL Eibhlin, she asks us what we want > to do, lead time needed, styles in which we paint,specific list: > gentles that we would like to paint a scroll for, if we need to > return an assignment for any reason she is super supportive and > responds to our emails and phone calls the same day.....yes, we > are spoiled and we know it, but we also produce a high quality > product with consistency. > > Adieu, > THL Antoinette de la Croix of Stormsport > who is a Social Engineer in her mundane world > > > =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2001 18:47:59 -0500 (EST) From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" Subject: RE: [scribes]: scrolls backlogs On Fri, 16 Mar 2001, PRW wrote: > not. On the otherhand, this also leads to an "expectation" of scrolls to be > awarded in Court by the populace. While that is both good and bad.. I > think, perhaps, the vast talent that I have seen going into these scrolls > becomes undervalued. When the general populace sees 11-20 scrolls, every > weekend, all of remarkable or higher caliber being handed out, new scribes > can feel overwhelmed at the task and so shy away, experienced scribes can > quickly burn out, as their work is "expected" and the populace can become > jaded to the absolute amount of beauty and effort involved in these scrolls. I disagreee here. I have lived in three different kingdoms now, though my first has changed drastically since I was there, and the second changed significantly while I was there. In the Midrealm in the olden days (twelve to fifteen years ago), promissories were frequently given out in court, mostly because the royalty often didn't think about awards with enough lead time to assign them and give them out. There were a number of scribes guilds and similar groups throughout the kingdom who burnt out doing last minute scrolls so that there would be something to hand out in court. Frequently, scribes would go to an event only to spend much of it in a back room doing last minute scribal work. These herculean efforts led to an expectation that scrolls would be done, or promissories given in court. I see many Midrealm scribes as over-worked and under-valued, and most scribal Laurels there are gods and goddesses in their art form, while people who are merely fantastic are overlooked. In Calontir (five to twelve years ago), the backlash from their experience under the Middle's system was that all scrolls given were nicely painted pre-prints. Everyone was very concerned that we "not burn out the scribes." Peerages were commissioned by the peerage candidate (possible because almost all peerages were announced in advance, though frequently candidates didn't know how to go about it, so peerage scrolls were often not completed in time for the ceremony), and specialty scrolls like court baroncies were done through the signet's office. The result of this was that the kingdom was not growing new scribes. New and original work wasn't seen in court, and no one was driven to improve. This started to change around the time I was Gold Falcon Signet, and I believe during the times of Mistress Aidan Cocrinn's, and THL Chendra ferch Rhudd's terms in that office. We started doing original scrolls for the grant of arms level orders, with new scroll wordings and pre-prints being put together specific to each reign for the AOA level orders. Requirements for the work done on pre-prints went up as well, with more of them being painted with gouache and similarly appropriate paints, and fewer showing up in marker and colored pencil. The result was that Calontir has some truly remarkable scribes. I know that their system has changed even more since then; I know that for a while at least, most scrolls were done in a document style with fairly little in the way of illumination. I am not sure what their system is now. And, ah, AEthelmearc! Scrolls are generally assigned well in advance through the Signet's office. THL Eibhlin does a marvelous job meeting the needs of the scribes while also seeing to the requirements of the royalty. (The system has fallen down once or twice when we have had less organized royalty, but for the most part, we have been bleesed with royalty that takes good care of their scribes.) We have had three signets since I've been here, each doing a good job, limiting our backlog and taking good care of us as scribes. Scribes are recognized in all courts, and frequently the scroll gets as much applause as the award itself. The signet's office also does and excellent job of teaching and nurturing new scribes with a twice yearly scribes and heralds symposium, and Eibhlin (wonderful lady!) has been doing scroll blank workshops at academies and scholas within the kingdom. So, Malcolm, I disagree that the level of expertise is intimidating here, mainly because of the nurturing environment that I see around us. > > So.. each 'culture' has benefits and pitfalls, that we, as scribes, face > every day. To my humble mind, any scroll, done by any scribe, for any > Kingdom is a gift to our Society in general and the efforts of the scribe > deserve praise. And to this, I agree most wholeheartedly. See you soon at a scribal workshop! Graidhne =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V5 #86 ****************************