From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V5 #65 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Thursday, March 8 2001 Volume 05 : Number 065 ======================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with unsubscribe scribes-digets in the body of the message. Leave the subject line blank. Do not include any additional text. Re: [scribes]: Re: Erasures from vellum [scribes]:Sealing wax (was Re: Natural beeswax) Re: [scribes]: Erasures from vellum Re: [scribes]: Erasures from vellum [scribes]: Re:Erasures from vellum ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 03:50:31 EST From: EowynA@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Re: Erasures from vellum In a message dated 3/7/01 3:10:10 PM, meisterin@comteck.com writes: << This book is written ENTIRELY on re-used vellum. >> It was a common enough practice that there is a word for vellum that has been scraped off and reused: palimpsest. After all, to scrape off the old words takes only time. There was lots of that. The vellum itself was the product of a herd of cattle, a measure of wealth in itself The first letter of the Anglo-Saxon futhark, feoh, means "wealth" and :"cattle," showing that the two are considered virtually equivalent in some societies. Eowyn =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 10:36:10 +0100 From: Anna Troy Subject: [scribes]:Sealing wax (was Re: Natural beeswax) - --=====================_4832908==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Well the stuff you get here in Sweden seems to be some kind of shellac mixture. There is the red stuff that Swedes use traditional use for Christmas presents that you melt with a candle http://www.slojd-detaljer.se/prodview.asp?art=730020 "God Jul" means Merry Christmas. It comes in a stick without a wick. Then there is the other stuff that I think is imported from England that can be other colors and sometimes has a wick in the middle. I've also seen that you can get a small melting ladle, kind of like smaller version of the thing you use to melt tin in. You use it to melt the sealing wax and the you pour it on. I suppose that would be more practical if you are going to have it separate on a ribbon. Anna de Byxe At 19:49 2001-03-07 +0000, you wrote: >Back to the gaget that was mentioned... > >I also remembered that the person said that they used a resin, not wax in >it...and if the seals of old were made of wax they would have the same >melting problem we have today...and they do not. So I am betting that >resin is more likely accurate in period. They said that they used it to >seal christmas stuff. > >If somebody loves to read,I would suggest reading archives to find out. > >I do not have any time for that...sorry. > >your servnat, >mahee > >_________________________________________________________________ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > >=================================================================== >To unsubscribe from this list, send email to >with a blank Subject: line and >unsubscribe scribes >in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in >the body. > "So many books, so little time." "Anna's Crafts Links Page" HAS MOVED! to: http://owly.terrashare.com http://www.terrashare.com/join/owly - --=====================_4832908==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Well the stuff you get here in Sweden seems to be some kind of shellac mixture. There is the red stuff that Swedes use traditional use for Christmas presents that you melt with a candle http://www.slojd-detaljer.se/prodview.asp?art=730020 "God Jul" means Merry Christmas. It comes in a stick without a wick. Then there is the other stuff that I think is imported from England that can be other colors and sometimes has a wick in the middle. I've also seen that you can get a small melting ladle, kind of like  smaller version of the thing you use to melt tin in. You use it to melt the sealing wax and the you pour it on. I suppose that would be more practical if you are going to have it separate on a ribbon.

Anna de Byxe

At 19:49 2001-03-07 +0000, you wrote:
Back to the gaget that was mentioned...

I also remembered that the person said that they used a resin, not wax in it...and if the seals of old were made of wax they would have the same melting problem we have today...and they do not. So I am betting that resin is more likely accurate in period. They said that they used it to seal christmas stuff.

If somebody loves to read,I would suggest reading archives to find out.

I do not have any time for that...sorry.

your servnat,
mahee

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- --=====================_4832908==_.ALT-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 10:45:29 +0100 From: Anna Troy Subject: Re: [scribes]: Erasures from vellum - --=====================_5391903==_.ALT Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Well I've seen a picture of a book were, according to the book, somebody attempted to "wash away" some of the pictures (faces of the Popes and all of Thomas Becket) but it didn't work so well. Unfortunately I can't remember where I saw this. Anna de Byxe At 19:18 2001-03-07 -0500, you wrote: >It looks exactly like what happened to me the other day >trying to erase walnut ink from pergamenata. Even with >an electric eraser, there was a yellowish ghost image of >the letters. > >I wonder if the erased letters get darker with time, like >some inks do? Maybe when it was originally erased, >the leftover image was a lot less noticable? > >Chiara da Ravenna >Stonemarche, East (NH) > >=================================================================== >To unsubscribe from this list, send email to >with a blank Subject: line and >unsubscribe scribes >in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in >the body. "So many books, so little time." "Anna's Crafts Links Page" HAS MOVED! to: http://owly.terrashare.com http://www.terrashare.com/join/owly - --=====================_5391903==_.ALT Content-Type: text/html; charset="us-ascii" Well I've seen a picture of a book were, according to the book, somebody attempted to "wash away" some of the pictures (faces of the Popes and all of Thomas Becket) but it didn't work so well. Unfortunately I can't remember where I saw this.

Anna de Byxe

At 19:18 2001-03-07 -0500, you wrote:

It looks exactly like what happened to me the other day
trying to erase walnut ink from pergamenata. Even with
an electric eraser, there was a yellowish ghost image of
the letters.

I wonder if the erased letters get darker with time, like
some inks do? Maybe when it was originally erased,
the leftover image was a lot less noticable?

Chiara da Ravenna
Stonemarche, East (NH)

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- --=====================_5391903==_.ALT-- =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2001 23:23:23 +1100 From: Steve Roylance Subject: Re: [scribes]: Erasures from vellum hi I use a number 10 and 11 scalpel on vellum, on one scroll I was doing in three columns of text I was one word over on the second comumn (else the third column would have started with a line of one word and thrown out the balance), so I removed the last line of that column and added an extra word on the second last line and then finished the column in right place. I was working on the hair side and the erasure had to be explained before it was detectable. On another scroll I was working on the flesh side and left a very important word out, so a line and a half had to be removed, and this was very visible, I used the mantling from the device to mask much of the edges and the end of the line. Generally use a sharp scalpel try to shave in the same direction (never been able to do this) try to remove as little as possible light strokes go over the spot with white eraser after resize or paint with a dilute gum after as ever Thorfinn Melbourne, Australia "Julie C. Sparks" wrote: > > Greetings again, > > I am working on a diplomatic transcription of a 15th century French/ > Flemish book of hours for a senior project, and I was wondering what > methods of erasure from vellum you folks may have experimented with or > come across in your research. Of course I know the standard scraping > method, but I found a page in the calendar of this book where two line > seem to have been erased. Please see =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2001 09:35:53 EST From: RenScribe@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Re:Erasures from vellum I use a variety of methods to erase mistakes on vellum. If it's a large area, like the time I mismeasured and inked a page length column of acanthus about 2 inches from where it should have been <> I use the same pumice stone I used to prepare the vellum with and pretend I haven't started the piece yet. I'm a lot more careful after making that *big* mistake, so most of my mistakes now are smaller. If it's a letter, line of text, a device.... something that needs spot repair, I use either a craft knife or a scratch knife. My scratch knife is about the size of a large nib and fits into my nib holder. It's shaped like a spoon with a pointed tip. the edges are sharp as razor blades. I always tell folks when fixing mistakes, pretend you are getting paid by the minute. Wait for the mistake to dry completely. Then *slowly* begin to scrape at the mistake. I hold the sharp edge of whatever tool I'm using at a 90 degree angle to the surface. It's a lot less likely to dig into it. Have patience, friction will do the work eventually. Don't use a lot of pressure, or you might leave a divot. Get about half of the mistake off, then use a white rubber eraser to help you see what is left. Although I was taught to work in only one direction I always work in a random or circular motion. I get smoother edges to my erasures this way. Go back to scraping and using the eraser where necessary. On vellum, I don't add more size, but I sometimes do on paper. Then burnish the spot you've just scraped. Pouncing the area with gum sandarac before you reuse it can help control any feathering that might occur. My first erasures on 140# HP paper were terribly obvious and messy. I learned that an already frustrating mistake in the middle of a special piece is not the best time to practice erasing. Take out some scraps of paper, make some marks and letters and try fixing them. Calligraph a few letters and then go back in and try to change them. Try one when it is still wet and compare the results to how good you can fix it when it's dry. Once you get the hang of it, practice taking printing off of junk mail or computer paper. It will teach you to have a light touch. Hoping nobody ever needs this information :-) Eibhlin ni Chaoimh AEthelmearc =================================================================== To unsubscribe from this list, send email to with a blank Subject: line and unsubscribe scribes in the body of the message. Do not include any additional text in the body. ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V5 #65 ****************************