From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V2 #751 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Tuesday, April 13 1999 Volume 02 : Number 751 In this issue: Re: [scribes]: Marriage contract Re: [scribes]: Class notes: what to NOT teach ultra-beginners? Re: Fw: [scribes]: Marriage contract Re: [scribes]: Class notes: what to NOT teach ultra-beginners? Re: [scribes]: Gesso [scribes]: Fw: seeking scroll Re: [scribes]: Gesso Re: [scribes]: Marriage contract ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 19:12:58 EDT From: MRomero106@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Marriage contract An idea.... You may at least look at the Jewish wedding ceremonies and the scroll they give. I believe the name is something like Techuba (although I would be surprised if I got the name correct.) This would at least give you a start somewhere. Any Jewish personas, scholars, or other who know more than I? Naquiib Zaid Sable Swan Herald Humble Western Scribe ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 19:20:08 -0400 From: Sally Burnell Subject: Re: [scribes]: Class notes: what to NOT teach ultra-beginners? Hmmmmmm, I don't know about Drogin as something I would necessarily use with a "rank" beginner. Do you have a copy of "Writing & Illuminating & Lettering" by Edward Johnston? This was and still is one of my favourite reference books for scribing, even now with my 20+ years of experience as a scribe. This is the book I used as an absolute rank beginner to teach myself scribing. I photocopy relevant parts of the book to use in scribing classes, yes, even with the absolute beginner types. And it is something that they can easily understand without confusing them or going over their heads. Just a suggestion, anyway........... Lady Saradwen Ariandalen Marche of Gwyntarian (Akron/Kent, OH) Midrealm At 01:05 AM 4/12/99 -0500, Mike C. Baker wrote: >Greetings, gang... > >I am at most a middling calligrapher, but with a conceit >that I am a passable teacher. End of this month, first >of next, I'm teaching a class I call "Ultra-beginning >Calligraphy". The great & burning question I lay before >the assemblage: what should I leave out, neglect to >mention, or advise strongly against? > >I'm trying to keep the class to core concerns, and have >already promised myself to mention illumination only >in passing (and with _only_ simplest diapering as my >example). > >Hey, I'm starting with monosyllables ("This is a pen. It >uses ink. These are pen strokes.") and expecting to >be working with squires and cadets for a significant >part of my audience. For all of the shortcomings, >I'm going to point them at the Speedball Handbook >and Mark Drogin. (As I said, ULTRA-beginners -- >and, yes, Drogin is appropriate even at that level >IMNSHO.) > >Opinions? Exemplars? Fruitbats? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 18:47:16 -0500 From: Gunnora Hallakarva Subject: Re: Fw: [scribes]: Marriage contract The best source of information I can offer would be The Medieval and Renaissance Wedding Site at http://www.spu.edu/~kst/bib/bib.html See particularly: Altieri, Marco Antonio. Li nuptiali. 1873. Rome: Roma nel Rinascimento, 1995. (If you can read Italian, this seems to be one of the best primary sources on Italian Renaissance wedding rituals. Originally written around 1509, it was reprinted in 1873. The 1873 printing was reprinted in 1995.) Bingham, Joel Foote. The Christian Marriage Ceremony: Its History, Significance and Curiosities: Ritual, Practical and Archaeological Notes; and the Text of the English, Roman, Greek and Jewish Ceremonies. New York: A. D. F. Randolph & Company, 1871. Brooke, Christopher Nugent Lawrence. The Medieval Idea of Marriage. Oxford: Oxford UP, 1989. (Historical study of how marriage was viewed, legally, ecclesiastically and socially, and how it evolved) Duby, Georges. Medieval Marriage: Two Models from Twelfth-century France. Trans. Elborg Forster. Johns Hopkins Symposia in Comparative History 11. Baltimore: Johns Hopkins UP, 1978. Duby, Georges. The Knight, the Lady, and the Priest: the Making of Modern Marriage in Medieval France. Trans. Barbara Bray. 1st American ed. New York: Pantheon Books, 1983. Fischer, Andreas. Engagement, Wedding and Marriage in Old English. Anglistische Forschungen 176. Heidelberg: Winter, 1986. Molho, Anthony. Marriage Alliance in Late Medieval Florence. Cambridge, Mass.: Harvard UP, 1994. Molin, Jean-Baptiste, and Protais Mutembe. Le Rituel du Mariage en France du XIIe au XVIe Siecle . Theologie Historique 26. Paris: Beauchesne, 1974. (One of the most frequently quoted works on the topic) Rollin, Betty. I Thee Wed: a Collection of Marriage Vows Past and Present, Here and There. 1st ed. Garden City, N.Y.: Doubleday, 1961. Roqueta, Joan. Lo Ritual Occitan del Maridatge: Testimoni d'una Civilisacion Originala: Edicion Sinoptica e Critica de Tres Rituals amb Formularis en Lenga Occitana (Bordeu 1466, Caors 1503, Perigus 1536), Seguida d'una Analisi de Textes Occitans Medievals e d'una Prepausicion de Ritual Moderne del Maridatge en Lenga d'Oc. Besiers: Centre Internacional de Documentacion Occitana, 1981. Searle, Mark, and Kenneth W. Stevenson. Documents of the Marriage Liturgy. Collegeville, Minn.: Liturgical P, 1992. (_The_ book to read for copies of the vows themselves. Includes a Jewish ceremony and a number of Christian liturgies from the Early Middle Ages to the present) Stevenson, Kenneth W. Nuptial Blessing: a Study of Christian Marriage Rites. New York: Oxford UP, 1983. (Chapter 2 is a good source for various rituals and ceremonies, while Chapter 3 deals with marriage customs during the Reformation) ::GUNNORA:: Franchesca Havas wrote: > Can you direct this request to someone in the know about marriage contracts? > > Sincerely, > F. Havas > Dallas, Texas > > -----Original Message----- > From: Garret Bitker > To: scribes@castle.org > Date: Monday, April 12, 1999 4:39 PM > Subject: [scribes]: Marriage contract > > :Greetings, > :I have been asked by a couple getting married to craft a period marriage > :contract for them. To that end I searched, and looked and have found... > :nothing. Do any of you really smart and nice people out there know of > :anything like this. > :Thank you for your time and ideas, > :yours, > :Gevehard von Baden > : > > -----Original Message----- > From: MRomero106@aol.com > To: gevehard@hutchtel.net ; scribes@castle.org > > Date: Monday, April 12, 1999 6:21 PM > Subject: Re: [scribes]: Marriage contract > > :An idea.... > : > :You may at least look at the Jewish wedding ceremonies and the scroll they > :give. I believe the name is something like Techuba (although I would be > :surprised if I got the name correct.) > : > :This would at least give you a start somewhere. > : > :Any Jewish personas, scholars, or other who know more than I? > : > :Naquiib Zaid > :Sable Swan Herald > :Humble Western Scribe > : ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 19:38:37 -0500 From: wyverns Subject: Re: [scribes]: Class notes: what to NOT teach ultra-beginners? Don't teach a hand that takes lots of strokes. (Probably obvious). Don't worry about teaching them the whole alphabet - a round letter, a letter with a stem, a capitol, and their name is probably enough to give them a good start, and has the advantage of being immediately useful. As an addition to using lines, having them trace letters has proven a useful exercise, especially if you have nervous students who are new to the whole field of 'art'. Tracing seems to lessen the threat of trying to visually copy. If you can, I would suggest having them use a slanted board from the start. Although I took one class as a beginner where I got to try a slanted board, and it worked great, I mostly learned on a table and I found it hard to switch later on, even though slanted board is easier overall. Don't try to cover spacing between lines, but letter/word spacing associated with the particular hand might be useful to mention in passing, if only so their names will look right. Enid (Atlantia) ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 00:17:06 EDT From: Ulfnaidan@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gesso In a message dated 99-04-12 14:15:53 EDT, you write: (lots of snippage) > > Hopefully, this will put all of my gesso problems behind me. > *ughhh*. If anyone is interested I will post these results to the list. > > Cystennin All I can think is "goodness, how organized and well thought out! No wonder I haven't had any luck with these experiments!" I would be very interested in hearing the results, however. Hope you don't mind lazy folks like me sucking up your research and hard work, rather than doing the experiments ourselves Aidan ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 12 Apr 1999 22:47:50 -0700 From: "Holly Grimmett" Subject: [scribes]: Fw: seeking scroll - ----- Original Message ----- From: JoAnn Abbott Newsgroups: rec.org.sca Sent: Monday, April 12, 1999 7:10 AM Subject: seeking scroll > Good gentles, > 4 years ago, while in Drachenwald, I created a scroll for a friend who > had been awarded the Kingdom arts award but who had never received the > scroll for it. This scroll is for Lady Karena the dancer, and the capital > "B" at the top of the page is formed by a dancer and her veils. I gave the > scroll to the (then) queen- sorry, I don't recall her name- and expected it > to be presented formally at the next court. > Well, court came and went, and so did the queen. And many other queens > as well. Karena never DID get the award scroll I worked so hard on, or even > any public granting of the award, other than the Prince who awarded it > saying something to the effect of "Y'know Karena, you deserve the Panasch, > so I'm giving you one" while around the campfire one night. If anyone has > or has seen this scroll, please send it either to Karena over there in > Drachenwald, or to me at the below address and I will get it to her. > > Thank You most kindly, > Lady JoAnna of the Singing Threads > > MKA > JoAnn Abbott > 107 B Evans st > Ft Huachuca, AZ, 85613 > > > ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 02:29:11 EDT From: FITCHYBEAR@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Gesso In a message dated 4/12/99 9:24:32 PM Pacific Daylight Time, Ulfnaidan@aol.com writes: << Hope you don't mind lazy folks like me sucking up your research and hard work, rather than doing the experiments ourselves Aidan >> Bad Aidan!!!! No biscuit!-JimBear ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 13 Apr 1999 02:29:10 EDT From: FITCHYBEAR@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Marriage contract In a message dated 4/12/99 2:37:46 PM Pacific Daylight Time, gevehard@hutchtel.net writes: << Greetings, I have been asked by a couple getting married to craft a period marriage contract for them. To that end I searched, and looked and have found... nothing. Do any of you really smart and nice people out there know of anything like this. Thank you for your time and ideas, yours, Gevehard von Baden >> You might look at Muslim marriage contracts or Jewish Katubahs if they are of neither religion, you could still adapt them to your purpose-JimBear ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V2 #751 *****************************