From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V2 #179 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Tuesday, July 21 1998 Volume 02 : Number 179 In this issue: Re: [scribes]: Paint on gold Re: [scribes]: Paint on gold [scribes]: Definitions [scribes]: english/latin text online (was durham gospel story) [scribes]: painting from shells Re: [scribes]: Tools of the trade ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 09:06:47 -0700 From: "Carolyn Richardson" Subject: Re: [scribes]: Paint on gold > Why would one mix in shells as opposed to a palette? Is there a reason > other than period practice? I.e., am I missing something technical > here? One reason I can think of for favoring shells over a palette is that I have a limited amount of palette space, but since I'm a self-confessed "steamed clam-aholic" I can get *tons* of shells. And they don't have to be cleaned so if you're working on a scroll over a long period of time you don't have to worry about having washed your palette with that one special color (which I've done in the past). With gouache you can just add some water and reconstitute it. The lip of the shell (where the 2 halves join) also makes a convenient place to wipe your extra paint off. My biggest problem with shells is that my cat seems to think they belong on the floor rather than on top of the 6 drawer stack I keep next to the drafting table to hold my paints and stuff. She doesn't do that with my palettes. Tetchubah of Greenlake, Caid ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 12:48:30 EDT From: FITCHYBEAR@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Paint on gold In a message dated 98-07-21 08:45:25 EDT, Lea.Viljanen@nixu.fi writes: << This is indeed interesting, since this intuitively feels right to me but last spring I got a mild comment from an A&S Fair judge that I had used too thick paint. >> I tend to use thin paint but many layers, I feel this gives me better control. If I feel that the paint is very thin I add more binder either egg yolk or gum arabic. With egg tempera, the painted area dries to the touch in about 1/2 hr. but doesn't fully dry and harden for a bout two weeks. Even if the tempera isn't fully hardened, I can apply a different colour over it, but it wount rehydrate the bottom layer unless I use a hellacious amount of water or scrub the lower level extremely hard (which would probably ruin my brush in the process). With gouache, application is everything and the paint will be mistakenly called too thick if it isn't smooth and slightly glossy. I'm not saying that thi sis the case in this instance, but it may a place to start- JimBear ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 16:54:43 -0500 From: randyaf@provide.net (Randy & Melody Asplund-Faith) Subject: [scribes]: Definitions "Laying in" of color just means putting some paint on the page. The techniques for doing this vary a lot by both effect, and the nature of the pigments or binders. For example, one can lay in a field of fine ground malachite as one normally paints, by just dragging a wet brush on the page. However, in order to lay in a field of coarse malachite, one needs to take it up in the brush with a lot of medium and after depositing it on the page, push the grains with the brush tip until they are piled up adjacent to each other. "Underbinding" means you did not get enough of the binder into your paint for the purpose you intend. The binder is the "glue" part of paint which holds the color to the surface once the paint dries. Binders include egg white tempera, egg yolk, gum arabic & other gums, garlic juice (thanks Jimbear!), drying oils like linseed and walnut, and modernly-acrylic polymer. If there is so much water separating the glue from the pigment, or if the paper is so absorbant that it soaks the binder into it but not the pigment (a serious problem for course ground colors), you have underbound paint. Why Shells for color? Reason # 1: Because "they" used them. More reasons by personal preference: I really find them handy. I used to have a big watercolor pallete which allowed me to put all of my colors out at once. But it took a lot of room on my table, and I poluted colors all the time, and it was a pain to clean out individual wells because I couldn't just stick it all under the tap. Now I have something where I can mix up any nuber of colors which I wan, and only grab the ones I need. If it gets poluted, I can clean it in the sink individually. It is so easy to hold one little shell in one hand close to the brush and the art. This is great because if I am working on really fine lines I can get very close to the color well and see the parts which are wettest, tip the fluid around, etc. The shell surface is not as slippery as synthetics like plastic or ceramic versions. When I want to pull off fluid by pulling the brush on the inside slope of the well (in order to get just the perfect amount of fluid charge in the brush), the shell surface seems to grip the paint and flow it off the hairs without beeding. This is really important and I believe has made a significant positive change in my technique. The shell can also be used as a brush rest if you ay the brush handle in the area where thehalves once joined. Just an axtra bonus! Ranthulfr Asparlundr Northwoods, Middle Kingdom Randy Asplund-Faith Science Ficion & Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr. Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 (734) 663-0954 http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 14:22:03 PDT From: "I.C. Kessler" Subject: [scribes]: english/latin text online (was durham gospel story) Wow what an incredably cool thing to have happen. >>** Though it has become very difficult to find a Latin Bible anywhere. Even a priest didn't have one. For an embroidery sampler based on the Lindisfarne Gospels, I wanted one of the Ecclesiastes lines in Latin, and could not find a Latin Bible to save my soul (so to speak). Finally got a translation of the phrase from the bookstore owner at ILIFF (a school of religion in Denver). Guess I'll keep looking for one in the used book stores. << Well it's not a gospel but there is a english/latin side by side Psalter (Book of Psalms, Old Testament)here: http://members.tripod.com/%7Egunhouse/psalmstxt/pshome.htm It took a long time but I printed the whole durn thing out and bound it. Each psalm is on it's own page. :( It might actually help with your latin to carefully read through it. It'll still probably be difficult to read period MS 'cause of all the abbreviations though. There's also a couple good pages with it explaining the translation/version. As the web grows it wouldn't surprise me to find an entire Vulgate Bible on line eventually. I keep looking... Isabel C Kessler ICQ# 7593252 Per bend vert and counter-ermine, on a bend counterchanged fimbriated, a greyhound courant argent. "I lie in my traces" ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 14:45:14 PDT From: "I.C. Kessler" Subject: [scribes]: painting from shells Ranthulfr Asparlundr wrote: >>It is so easy to hold one little shell in one hand close to the brush and the art. This is great because if I am working on really fine lines I can get very close to the color well and see the parts which are wettest, tip the fluid around, etc. << Before I got into SCA illumination, I used to use bottle caps, milk caps, and cut down film cans & lids for small amounts of re-constitutable paint. I kept them in a wood cigar box b/c they tended to collect dust if I left them out, then my paint would have dust in it. :( I like little clam shells I get off the beach here - they've been worn down a bit by the sand and they're nice and white with a smooth texture inside. They also have a little more heft than a milk cap. They tend to roll around a bit if I set them on a flat table so I usu. set them down on a folded rag. I guess if you had one of those high graded tables like you see in MS illustrations you'd have to set them somewhere else. Ranthulfr, any idea what "they" stored the shells in/on while "they" were working from them? I don't think I remember seeing any pictures of shells, just horns, usu. stuck through a hole in the work surface. - Isabel ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com ------------------------------ Date: Tue, 21 Jul 1998 07:13:01 +0100 From: David Columbus Subject: Re: [scribes]: Tools of the trade >Ha! I remember being one of those art students working at the art store and >not knowing diddly squat about what I was selling! Well, surprise surprise. >That's what you get in modern art schools where they don't bother teaching >tools and technique. I learned it all the hard way, just like you, while >studying about medieval illumination in the SCA. I read Ralph Mayer's book >THE ARTIST'S HANDBOOK an d did the art tradeshow thing where I actually >talked to the company reps. > > Your best bet is to ask at the art store for any brochures or other >technical pamphlets they may have tucked in a drawer somewhere. Usually >there is a sheet which tells about the ph and content of the manufacturer's >products. Most art stores are too cheesy about this, so failing that, you >can at least get company contact info from the art store and call or write >to them in care of either customer service or the technical department. >They can answer questions like "What products do you make which follow this >criteria:?" and "Where can I buy it?", or they may just mail you a >pamphlet. If you are lucky, there may be a website for your target >manufacturer. Try searching the net. > >Ranthulfr Asparlundr > >Man, I need a vacation. How long 'til Pennsic? Right. A very good point. Never depend on the clerk at the art store (even a college store) to know about many of the things that scribes are taught in the SCA. I too ran across this in school. I literally had to explain some of, what I thought, were the most basic of ideas. I was taught these concepts early on as a scribe by other scribes. And I was surprised when I had to teach my fellow students about these things things. Like what paint was made of! Basic differences in paper! And why was I using that pointed nib and ink bottle instead of a technical pen??? Art school taught me some very interesting techniques but it was the SCA that taught me the how and why of the materials used. As another scribes about your materials before you ask the art store clerk. There are mostly geared up to explain materials from a more commercial point of view. Christofano ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V2 #179 *****************************