From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V2 #1759 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Thursday, August 3 2000 Volume 02 : Number 1759 In this issue: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco RE: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco [scribes]: Re: More Walnut Fiasco Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco [scribes]: Walnut Ink Success! Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco [scribes]: great gilding size Re: [scribes]: Walnut Ink Success! Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco - gold ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 10:49:04 +0000 From: Randy Asplund Subject: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Ha ha ha ha ah! When I got up this morning and walked into the studio the walnut ink which I had ground on my marble slab had finally dried. Cool! I thought. Hmmm, little speckles of grit. Well I never did finish by doing the fine straining step. So I figured as long as it was conveniently on the slab that I would give it a little grind and see what happens. MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!! (Don't try this at home folks. Home insurance doesn't cover pulling your hair out!) RanthulfR - -- Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 See a Universe of art ranging from Medieval Manuscripts to Star Trek and Magic: The Gathering at: http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 11:52:14 -0400 From: alienor Subject: Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Wait, don't throw that hair away--I have a use for it. I'm intending to use mine as packing material for the scroll which I have been TRYING to gild all week. I have found that gold will stick to literally anything, including passing airplanes, but not to vellum. Cheers, Alienor Randy Asplund wrote: > Ha ha ha ha ah! When I got up this morning and walked into the studio the > walnut ink which I had ground on my marble slab had finally dried. Cool! I > thought. > > Hmmm, little speckles of grit. Well I never did finish by doing the fine > straining step. So I figured as long as it was conveniently on the slab that I > would give it a little grind and see what happens. > > MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!! > > (Don't try this at home folks. Home insurance doesn't cover pulling your hair out!) > > RanthulfR > -- > > Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 > Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration > 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 > > See a Universe of art ranging from Medieval Manuscripts > to Star Trek and Magic: The Gathering at: > http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 12:02:38 -0400 From: "Alexandra" Subject: RE: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Hugs! Anything cemented where it doesn't belong is bad.... but... What's a muller? Alex the Clueless - -----Original Message----- From: owner-scribes@castle.org [mailto:owner-scribes@castle.org]On Behalf Of Randy Asplund Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 6:49 AM To: Scribes; Liz Bodenmiller; Ree Moorhead Pruehs Subject: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Ha ha ha ha ah! When I got up this morning and walked into the studio the walnut ink which I had ground on my marble slab had finally dried. Cool! I thought. Hmmm, little speckles of grit. Well I never did finish by doing the fine straining step. So I figured as long as it was conveniently on the slab that I would give it a little grind and see what happens. MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!! (Don't try this at home folks. Home insurance doesn't cover pulling your hair out!) RanthulfR - -- Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 See a Universe of art ranging from Medieval Manuscripts to Star Trek and Magic: The Gathering at: http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 12:02:37 -0400 From: Ree Moorhead Pruehs Subject: [scribes]: Re: More Walnut Fiasco At 10:49 AM 8/3/00 +0000, Randy Asplund wrote: >Ha ha ha ha ah! When I got up this morning and walked into the studio the >walnut ink which I had ground on my marble slab had finally dried. Cool! I >thought. > >Hmmm, little speckles of grit. Well I never did finish by doing the fine >straining step. So I figured as long as it was conveniently on the slab that I >would give it a little grind and see what happens. > >MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!! > >(Don't try this at home folks. Home insurance doesn't cover pulling your >hair out!) > >RanthulfR Did anyone ever tell you it's damned painful to laugh when one has laryngitus? ;D Ree ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 09:17:49 -0700 From: Carolyn_Richardson@cch.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco >>MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!!<< Well, I guess that will teach us all not to leave our mullers in unknown substances just in case they get stuck. Good luck chipping it out of there, Randy. Since most mullers I know are made of glass it might be easier to just buy a new one. Tetchubah of Greenlake, Caid ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 11:29:24 -0500 (CDT) From: "Pixel, Queen of Cats" Subject: Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco > > >>MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!!<< > Maybe if you soaked it in a pan of water, a la dirty dishes? Granted, you might be soaking it for months... Margaret FitzWilliam Tor Aerie, Northshield, Midrealm ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 13:17:13 +0000 From: Randy Asplund Subject: [scribes]: Walnut Ink Success! OK, remember the walnut ink fiasco? Well after I found the stuff all dried up this morning I discovered that it could be easily rehydrated. So I ground it on the slab for a little while and then poured it into a small jar. I added a little water to dilute it enough to try writing. Then I pulled out a goose quill and tried it on some smooth paper. Not only did it write very black, but it did fine hairlines and everything. It took a little longer to dry than my india ink, but it wasn't bad like the first time I tried to dry it. When dry I gave it a light rub with a tissue. It was stuck on the page very well, although a few spots did seem to give a little dust which caused a very, very light grey smear. Maybe those spots were still a touch moist or the material wasn't ground quite fine enough. Either I could try grinding a little smoother or I could add a touch of gum arabic and I am certain that wouldn't happen at all. I slab ground the material to the point that it would write black right up until the material was emptied from the quill. That tells me it is not depositing much in the way of grain texture. RanthulfR - -- Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 See a Universe of art ranging from Medieval Manuscripts to Star Trek and Magic: The Gathering at: http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 3 Aug 2000 13:09:29 -0400 (EDT) From: "Cecelia M. Hughes" Subject: Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Ah, yes. I discovered this week that while it would stick quite permantently to my 3 year old's knees and feet, I CANNOT get it to stick properly to the scroll! (My young son came downstairs Sunday saying, "Don't look, mom, don't look!" When I expressed my intent to go upstairs anyway, he said, Please, Mom, no spankings!" So now I need more gold leaf... Sigh... Graidhne On Thu, 3 Aug 2000, alienor wrote: > Wait, don't throw that hair away--I have a use for it. I'm intending to use mine as > packing material for the scroll which I have been TRYING to gild all week. I have > found that gold will stick to literally anything, including passing airplanes, but not > to vellum. > > Cheers, > Alienor > > Randy Asplund wrote: > > > Ha ha ha ha ah! When I got up this morning and walked into the studio the > > walnut ink which I had ground on my marble slab had finally dried. Cool! I > > thought. > > > > Hmmm, little speckles of grit. Well I never did finish by doing the fine > > straining step. So I figured as long as it was conveniently on the slab that I > > would give it a little grind and see what happens. > > > > MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!! > > > > (Don't try this at home folks. Home insurance doesn't cover pulling your hair out!) > > > > RanthulfR > > -- > > > > Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 > > Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration > > 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 > > > > See a Universe of art ranging from Medieval Manuscripts > > to Star Trek and Magic: The Gathering at: > > http://www.provide.net/~randyaf > > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 13:34:19 +0000 From: Randy Asplund Subject: Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco A muller is to a slab what a pestle is to a mortar. Instead of being a curved surface as with mortar and pestle, the muller is totally flat to work on a totally flat slab. That is why fine grinds are only possible on a slab with a muller. If you use mortar and pestle some material always slides out and doesn't grind. Plus it is about a ZILLION times faster to grind things on the slab! RanthulfR Alexandra wrote: > > Hugs! > > Anything cemented where it doesn't belong is bad.... but... What's a > muller? > > Alex the Clueless > > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-scribes@castle.org [mailto:owner-scribes@castle.org]On > Behalf Of Randy Asplund > Sent: Thursday, August 03, 2000 6:49 AM > To: Scribes; Liz Bodenmiller; Ree Moorhead Pruehs > Subject: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco > > Ha ha ha ha ah! When I got up this morning and walked into the studio the > walnut ink which I had ground on my marble slab had finally dried. Cool! I > thought. > > Hmmm, little speckles of grit. Well I never did finish by doing the fine > straining step. So I figured as long as it was conveniently on the slab that > I > would give it a little grind and see what happens. > > MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!! > > (Don't try this at home folks. Home insurance doesn't cover pulling your > hair out!) > > RanthulfR > -- > > Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 > Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration > 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 > > See a Universe of art ranging from Medieval Manuscripts > to Star Trek and Magic: The Gathering at: > http://www.provide.net/~randyaf - -- Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 See a Universe of art ranging from Medieval Manuscripts to Star Trek and Magic: The Gathering at: http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 13:37:21 +0000 From: Randy Asplund Subject: Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco Ack NO! I'm glad I tried water before chisel! I handmade my muller from a broken marble window pane. RanthulfR Carolyn_Richardson@cch.com wrote: > > >>MY MULLER IS CEMENTED TO MY SLAB!!!!!<< > > Well, I guess that will teach us all not to leave our mullers in unknown > substances just in case they get stuck. Good luck chipping it out of > there, Randy. Since most mullers I know are made of glass it might be > easier to just buy a new one. > > Tetchubah of Greenlake, Caid - -- Randy Asplund (734) 663-0954 Science Fiction and Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr., Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 See a Universe of art ranging from Medieval Manuscripts to Star Trek and Magic: The Gathering at: http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 15:45:40 -0500 From: David Nolan Subject: [scribes]: great gilding size Hey, for all of you who have trouble getting your leaf to stick, I found a fantastic size--it's completely non-period, but it works so well and so fast, I don't care. It's called Permacoll Mirror Gloss Paper Size. I got it from Baggot Leaf Co. Their web address is listed on their catalog as goldleaf.net, but I haven't been able to access it successfully lately. The phone # is 212-431-GOLD, fax is 212-431-3962. I just paint it on, fairly thinly because if you try to bead it up too much, it dries wrinkly. I can get a slight raised appearance, more so than gum ammoniac, for example. Perhaps using plain gesso first, then applying the Permacoll would give the really raised look. Haven't tried that yet though. I let it dry for a bit, usually it takes less than an hour, but this week it's taking longer, the dampness is pervasive. I usually can stick the leaf on without breathing on the size first, even when the air is fairly dry. I burnish lightly through glassine, then buff with silk, and you'd be amazed by the results! It really does give a mirror finish, assuming the size was applied smoothly, and even with brush strokes, it looks pretty good. I can gild an entire Book of Hours style scroll in about a half hour (after the drying time, of course. Baggot Leaf also sells all the gilding sizes that the Gabriel Guild makes. I definitely recommend their catalog, and the owner, Grace Baggot is extremely knowledgeable about all aspects of gilding. Chiara da Ravenna, Stonemarche, East (a very moist NH) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 17:32:34 -0500 From: wyverns Subject: Re: [scribes]: Walnut Ink Success! If I followed the explanation properly, you were writing with the overcooked black stuff from the bottom of the pan, and it gave you a nice fine line? It sounds like you have achieved a good batch of lamp black ink. The first home made ink I tried (to write with, not to make - -- someone did that and gave me a small jar full to use) was made from a more traditional source of burnt carbon, but essential the same chemical I expect. It does make a very nice ink, but I found that even after straining it, excess blacking eventually came out of solution with the water and gathered as grit at the bottom of the jar and on my writing. Still nice and black but I got tired of working around the grit and went back to my sumi ink. I was also told by a moderately reliable source that lamp black ink is rather acidic and will, at the least, fade. But then I think I've read the same here on the list about the not-waterproof sumi that I use... Enid ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 17:49:59 -0500 From: wyverns Subject: Re: [scribes]: More Walnut Fiasco - gold Over the years I've learned that gold sticks to fingers, dog noses, cat paws, metal once touched by the human hand, humidity-effected paper, even glacene paper on occasion, though usually glacene paper that has been in the slightest contact with size sometime in its life... Fortunately it does not seem to stick to cotton  swabs (which gives you SOMETHING to work with) and rarely sticks to my hair, or I would by now be a burnished blond instead of a brunette. If whatever sizing you are using has worked in the past but doesn't this week, check the weather. If it's dry (or if it's really hot and humid outside so that the air conditioning is running more than usual inside), I always have to use an extra layer of sizing above and beyond what I usually use. (I use one of the white glue types, a water-based one that I think is intended for gilding frames or something but works great on paper and vegetabele vellum). Good luck! Enid Atlantia ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V2 #1759 ******************************