From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V2 #112 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Friday, June 26 1998 Volume 02 : Number 112 In this issue: Re: [scribes]: Painted Calligraphy [scribes]: Re: First Scroll [scribes]: Re:[scribes] Watercolors Re: [scribes]: Grrrrr! Re: [scribes]: Re: First Scroll ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 15:56:09 -0700 From: Celeste Chadwick Subject: Re: [scribes]: Painted Calligraphy At 02:26 PM 6/25/98 -0700, you wrote: < >I missed the original post, but am responding to Calote's comments on painted >versus penned Celtic half-uncial. I am almost certain that the scribes used a >pen. There are a couple of factors involved. First, the differentiation >between thick and thin would be impossible to obtain from a brush with any >consistency because of the natural tencency of the bristles to splay out. >Second, if you look at the hands, sometimes you can clearly see where the scribe >reloaded the pen, and it corresponds very closely with how long it takes me to >use up all the ink in one of my pens. Third, a feather quill is extremely soft >when it's been soaking for a while and it splays quite nicely with a slight >amount of pressure. Finally, Calote has made the assumption that twisting a pen >is a tough thing, and I'd have to disagree. < I was thinking more along the lines of those who use a paintbrush to paint calligraphy like it would look like if done with a pen, not using the paintbrush AS a pen, if you understand what I mean by the difference. Kind of like how I do all of my Calligraphy (having never taken the time to learn how to do it properly [YET]), and how a couple of other scribes on here have posted in the past about painting the calligraphy on to a background that would be difficult to calligraph on because of the pen nib scratching the background or JimBear with the same reason as myself. I was wondering if anyone did something like that in period... Hmm... maybe I should put a picture up of one of my scrolls so people can have a look at painted calligraphy and see if they can really tell the difference unless they're looking CLOSELY. =) Celeste de la Montagne, AoA, JdL Barony of Lions Gate, An Tir (Vancouver, BC Canada) ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 22:19:50 EDT From: EowynA@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Re: First Scroll In a message dated 6/25/98 9:50:57 AM, many people have written on the topic, << This makes me think back to my own first assignment......... >> I still have the first scroll I did. It is an AA for Pwyll pen Tyrhon. I chose it off the West Kingdom backlog for scrolls in the Principality of Caid, and by the time it was done, that former Baron of Angels and Isles had disappeared from the SCA. I ran into him years later at an event (Coronation of Guy and Troy, I think -- in Isles or Darach?), but he never came back. So after having it rattle around the Chancellor of Scribes' box (Principality days) and Scribe Armarius's box, I finally took custody again. It is on the cheap "parchment" paper, with figures out of George Bain's book. I had just finished reading the Merne book on how to do knotwork, so there are some original knots there in Merne's style (not historical, but very nice, I think). The calligraphy is, well, a decent "modern and original" attempt at Insular Majuscule, without much understanding of how the script really works. It is good to see where one started sometimes, Eowyn Amberdrake, Caid ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 19:28:47 -0700 From: "Gael Stirler, SCA Lady Dairine" Subject: [scribes]: Re:[scribes] Watercolors Anna wrote regarding Aquarelle-- >Sorry if I got my terminology wrong, I'm talking about the type of >watercolor paints that are so popular now a days :-) A better question would be when was gouache first put in use. Watercolors, aquarelle, and gouache were one and the same until modern times. In period they were just called tempera or pigments. If mixed with water and gum, the pigments made a paint just like modern watercolors. Depending on how much water is added you can get effects from very dense to totally transparent. Look closely at period examples and you will see the evidence of transparent paints as well as opaque. If an opaque powder like chalk, zinc, or white lead, were added to the pigment it behaved and reflected light like gouache. If mixed with egg and water it made a beautifully transparent, quick-drying paint. In many period manuscripts all three techniques were used on the same page. The artist chose the mixture of pigment and medium that gave the effect needed for the piece. The griselle (underpainting) might be done in an opaque mixture, the glazes or the colored areas in a transparent mixture and then whitework and highlights in opaque paint. Though there are many examples of opaque watercolors being used in the 15th and16th century, gouache as we know it was not available until the early part of the 20th century. It was developed for the use of textile designers. They needed opaque colors that matched the colors of the fibers they were using to weave patterns. Watercolor can be made into gouache by adding white, but gouache cannot be made into a watercolor by adding water. It is harder to mix gouache colors with because the pigments have to compete with the opaque white. So you have to buy a wider variety of colors to achieve the same effect if you only use gouache. Therefore it is usually better and cheaper to use watercolor instead of commercial gouache and mix as you go. Sincerely, Lady Dairine mor o' h'Uigin - -- Gutenberg School of Scribes http://renstore.com/articles/GSS/index.shtml ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1998 23:31:39 EDT From: SCOTSWMMN@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Grrrrr! (snip) << I've had a theory for a while that my calligraphy goes better if I have a glass of wine while I do it (it helps stabilize my shaky hand - either that or I just don't care about it ;-)), so I had some red wine last night while working on it. Maybe that was my problem before - I wasn't sipping wine in between pen dips. >> That is definitely a pleasant way of relaxing the muscles, I think, especially during those times when I have unknowingly taken a death grip on my pen! The only thing that I have to be careful about is being sure that I sip the wine, and dip the pen in the ink, instead of vice versa....... Margaret ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 26 Jun 1998 14:25:08 +1000 From: Steve Roylance Subject: Re: [scribes]: Re: First Scroll Hi, I not quite sure what to call my first scroll, as I did a C&Ied letter to Mistress Rowan Perigrynne asking to a do work for the Scribes. It is still in the office files and it gets brought out on occasions, usually when there is one on my newer works being shown to enthuse others as the difference is enormous. It shows that you can get better. The first scroll I did was the AoA for Richard of Seahaven. As the West runs the scrolls after the award system and this one was severely overdue (about 6 years), so I looked at some designs I had and did a celtic one (I did not know how to do gold so I picked a style with no gold, thus no compromise) it was meant to look like the scribe had been busy doing it for all that time. It is based on Lindisfarne Major page and I am told second hand that it won some prizes. Just keep going, get feed back and practise, from one of the worst people for doing this, if I was not so distracted by other past times I would do as much as many of you, but so many things to be involved in and so little time to do it. as ever Thorfinn, Lochac, West Melbourne, Australia ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V2 #112 *****************************