From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V2 #53 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Thursday, June 4 1998 Volume 02 : Number 053 In this issue: Re: [scribes]: (fwd) autobounced email - cought on subject line Re: [scribes]: Grisaille Info from JimBear [scribes]: Challenge Re: [scribes]: Specializing and what I'm working on Re: [scribes]: H*lp Re: [scribes]: Purple as a main color? [scribes]: Re: Paints (fwd) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 11:48:55 -0400 From: Heather Swann Subject: Re: [scribes]: (fwd) autobounced email - cought on subject line I've seen pages with demons, animals, and people putting words in place and/or eating them, or taking them away...I've never seen a line connected to the word. Sometimes the word will be tucked under someone's arm, or being actively chewed on. Miri > Good gentles, I come to you again for assistance. The AoA scroll I'm > working on is d*#% near done and I just found out I left a word out of the > blazon. After a panicky call to a good scribal friend, I've decided to use > a drollery to fix it. I seem to recall seeing one with a little demon (?) > pulling the word into place. I say demon because he had a pointed tail, > which I *think* was pointing to where the word should go. > > I can't find any examples in the books I have, but am betting that some of > you have references with a similar style correction. I'm thinking of using > a mouse to "pull" the word, since a mouse is on the recipient's heraldry > (and it is the color of the mouse that is the missing word!) To be *very* > specific: Is the figure pulling a line leading to the word, or directly on > the word itself? If there is a line, does it go underneath the word or > connect to the first letter? Or should the mouse be pulling directly on > the letter, with a *very* long tail pointing to the correct location for > the word? > > Hopefully awaiting your replies.... > Lucia > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 12:44:00 -0400 (EDT) From: stacey jill wahrman Subject: Re: [scribes]: Grisaille Info from JimBear JimBear's grisaille info was really interesting, because I've been going at it in completely opposite way, since I treat it like working with watercolors. I started doing it on my own, so I haven't picked up any bad habits from anyone, and if I'm doing it wring the blame is totally mine. But what I do is take black gouache and mix some that very dilluted, and start with the *lightest* shades first, and layer the lightest shades with gouache so diluted it's almost water, just as you would for watercolors. Then gradually using more gouache and less water I layer it all the way up to black, producing a monochromatic painting, which was how I interpreted the grissaille. I just based the technique on what I know of modern paints, and I think that it's been turning out well. I've been getting some really fine detailing on it with the light-to-dark technique. I didn't even know you could dilute sumi like paint, so I'll have to try that next. I'll work on training myself to think dark-to-light rather than light-to-dark, it sounds like a really neat idea that would give a terrific appearance of depth. I'm so glad we have this list now! I love getting new ideas for things, and I'm really looking forward to meeting folks at Pennsic and seeing everyone's work. Oh, and what I've been working on is a just-finished joint project Pearl (kingdom A&S) with Renata von Hentzau, with a Middle Eastern design and references both to the recipient's dancing and her collection of Cinderella stuff. The script looks a lot like Arabic, but if you look closely at the borders, what looks like Arabic is actually "alla kazoola, mencha karoola, bibbity bobbity boo..." We're wondering how long it will take her to spot it. I also just finished another Pearl in a Gothic French style, with lots of leaves and vines and bright colors and pictures of the recipient doing various things. And I started blocking out an AoA based on a mystical Pentecost, with the pictures going in all directions. And no, I don't think I specialize (I've also done Hebrew and Celtic), I love trying new things. Like Miri, I use a technical pen to line things. From what I've seen, most outlining in manuscripts looks like it was done with a crow quill as well as a brush, and I find a .05 technical pen gives the same effect. Where it would be inappropriate to have a black outline, I use a 000 brush, but outlining makes things stand out really nicely and I'm really attatched to my tech pen. That was probably closer to 10 cents, based on length rather than content ;-) Arianwen ferch Maelgwn Ponte Alto, Atlantia - -=*=-=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=-=*=- Stacey Wahrman wahrman@wam.umd.edu Like a parrot in a picture window, I can see where I want to be. But repeated blows to my feathered little head Have taught me not to fly straight. -- The Bobs ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 14:23:56 -0400 (EDT) From: randyaf@provide.net (Randy & Melody Asplund-Faith) Subject: [scribes]: Challenge Here's a challenge for people with good eyes and enlarged MS reproductions. My apprentce and I had out a Lindisfarne Gospells and were checking out the dots in detail to figure out what tool really was used to make them. We think we not only know the tool, but we also think we see when the scribe rotated the page! The challenge is: Who can find a "Celtic" MS where the red dots are all perfectly round AND exactly the same size? No triangles, blobs with tails, rectangles, or trapazoids. Ranthulfr Asparlundr, snipe hunt leader Randy Asplund-Faith Science Ficion & Fantasy Illustration 2101 S. Circle Dr. Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 (734) 663-0954 http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 14:38:00 EDT From: Luiseach@aol.com Subject: Re: [scribes]: Specializing and what I'm working on Hello, Luighseach here in cold, grey, foggy Dreiburgen. What I specialize in is calligraphy--I write several historic hands, Uncial to Bastarda in time period, do gold leaf and I draw and paint borders _if_ I can trace the basic design or lay it out on a grid. I don't draw well so I don't do portraits, etc. My idea of scribal heaven is a long lead time to work and a talented illustrator as partner. Someone to fix my dinner and clean my house would be OK too My last project was the calligraphy for a Laurel scroll on vellum, yummy stuff that it is, under partial heaven conditions-short lead time, great illustrating partner, my kids fixed dinner and my house is still a mess. Next project will be doing promissories for their soon-to-be-crowned Majesties of Caid, Ivan and Anastasiia; I start tonight. Luighseach nic Lochlainn ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 15:13:00 -0700 From: "Thomas Brownwell" Subject: Re: [scribes]: H*lp I'm not used to seeing corrections on "lines" being drawn into place, but rather on "ribbons", like a long banner with the words streaming back. I love the idea of a mouse with the ribbon in its teeth, tail pointing back to the spot where the correction is needed. You could even go so far as to make the critter a true marginalia beast, with front half being mouse and rear half serpentine (could justify the length of the tail). Check out the Luttrell Psalter at http://schools.channel4.com/online_resources/netnotes/hialp/hialpnn.html for some fun examples of demi-critters used as space fillers and decoration. In the past I've even done the missing text directly on a long, smooth serpent coiled around the body of the text (luckily the illuminator didn't have a fit when I suggested we fill in her serpents with words). Can you make a mouse small enough to actually fit between the spaces? If so, you could have it eating the words, again on a banner, pulling the words just out of their proper place and away toward the margin to munch. Hopefully that'll give you some ideas, and others are sure to roll in. Good luck, and let us know what you finally decide upon! Corrections are a pain (more work) but if done right can actually be a lot of fun for the recipient. My favorite was on a scroll for one "Randwulf de la ..." whose name was given to me as "Randulf", a perfectly good spelling of the Saxon name. What to do??? Well, there was a ton of room below his name (I'd double spaced around the name), so I penned in a dropped "w" kind of on its side, at about 45 degrees off, just below where it should be, right after the "d". Then I painted a gold cord around the left arm of the "w", extended the cord up over the ascender of the "d" and looped it around the serif (luckily it was Early Gothic, with big flourishy serifs), then extended the cord to the "R", where I tied it off on the main loop of the "R" with a big bow / knot. The recipient loved it and actually thought I'd done it on purpose just for the fun of it. I think he's been disabused of that idea, but the key was that it was so cute and so deliberate looking that it *was* indeed convincing. So, I'll bet your scroll will be greeted with the same enthusiasm. Get over your fear and trepidation, and have some creative fun! Yours in Service. - ------------------------------------------------------------------------ Douglas Brownell AKA Thomas Brownwell, Calligrapher, brownwell@home.com Dancer,Silversmith,Singer,Cobbler,... San Diego, CA Barony of Calafia, Caid The 4 elements = good physics stuff:: Or,a fountain, a chief rayonny gules. Goutte enough herald:: (Fieldless) A goutte barry wavy azure and argent. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 18:43:16 +0100 From: David Columbus Subject: Re: [scribes]: Purple as a main color? >In a message dated 98-06-04 02:39:52 EDT, sknouse@msuvx2.memphis.edu writes: > ><< I'm going to paint the scroll with these colors including green. > My question is: Does anyone know of any manuscripts that have purple > and/or green in them in large amounts. I have only been able to find > touches of purple in all the books I've searched. Either way I'm going > to use these colors since it is my own personal scroll, but it would be > nice to know if there is any period precedent for these colors being > dominant (in contrast to the normal red and blue dominance). > > -- > Lady Mylisant de la Croix > Barony of Grey Niche, Meridies > > Purpure, two natural seahorses addorsed on a point pointed > argent a crescent inverted sable and on a chief triangular >> > > You might try looking at Italian rennisance scrolls but they won't be bars >and Ivy. entire vellum is dyed purple and you could go from there-JimBear Is there any reason WHY you have to have a period exemplar to allow you to do it? I did one for a friend who's colors were green and purple. All I did was change the blue and red to green and purple. When asked, the reason I gave was, "That's the colors she wanted!" The design is perfectly period and I find it a refreshing change from blue and red. If your heart says to do something, then don't let anyone tell you otherwise. You're doing this for your satisfaction... not theirs. B'wana Christofano O.L. P.V. ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 4 Jun 1998 12:48:15 -1000 From: Jan McEwen Subject: [scribes]: Re: Paints (fwd) Mistress Miriel said that I could forward this to the list. It is her comments on reading a post from Ranthulfr. Catriona - ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Jan McEwen, Horticulturist-at-Large, Kailua, Hawaii SCA: Catriona Stewart of the Glens, Barony of the Western Seas, Caid Internet: jmcewen@hawaii.edu - ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Wed, 3 Jun 1998 07:50:29 -1000 From: Barbara Taylor To: jmcewen@hawaii.edu Subject: Re: Paints > When I took my first lesson in illumination back in the early > eighties at a SCA demo I was shown to use egg yolk. Then I started doing > research and discovered glair and the proper use of gum arabic. I also > learned that the reason my yolk pictures tended to crack and sometimes > flake off paper was because yolk has a drying oil in it which becomes > stiff. I stopped using it for anything not on rigid support. > > So here's some questions for you folks who use yolk on scrolls: > > 1) How do you keep it from flaking and cracking? Do you add something, > paint it thinner, or just not seem to see a problem after the first year or > two? > > 2) What period sources do you have for its use on the page as opposed to on > the panel? > > I'm still accumulating knowlege. I plan to do something with it one > of these days. This is one of my gaps. Thanks ahead of time to whoever > replies! > > Ranthulfr I've never had a problem with yolk paint flaking or cracking. Of course, I don't know how all my scrolls have weathered and I mostly use it for panel painting. How does he make the yolk medium? I put a piece of cheesecloth over a wide mouth jar and strain the yolk into about a teaspoon and a half of distilled water. This takes out any white that might be clinging to the membrane and dilutes the yolk to a watery consistency. The I add a drop or two of water to the dry pigment, smush it around till it's nice and liquid and add the yolk medium, drop by drop with an eye dropper. There's a lot of water in this paint as a result and it goes on fairly thin. I usually build up a couple of layers. It takes some fiddling to know how much yolk to add to different pigments, too, as they have different qualities of oil absorption and some take more, some less. The guideline I was given was to paint a few strokes onto a piece of glass. The paint should appear slightly shiny, like an eggshell. If it looks greasy there is too much yolk, if it's chalky and flakes when dry, there is too little. It should adhere well and scrape up in a cohesive film with a razor. I have no idea whether yolk was used on a page as opposed to a panel. I would have to look that up. I mostly did it because it was what I was familiar with (from panels) and I didn't know any better! You can post this from me if you think it worthwhile and don't mind the trouble. See you tomorrow. Miriel ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V2 #53 ****************************