From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V2 #12 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Monday, May 18 1998 Volume 02 : Number 012 In this issue: Re: [scribes]: Teaching Calligraphy [scribes]: ARTWORK Re: [scribes]: ARTWORK [scribes]: Master John RE: [scribes]: Teaching Calligraphy [scribes]: Burnishing gold Re: [scribes]: Master John Re: [scribes]: Master John Re: [scribes]: Burnishing gold ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 08:08:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Elizabeth Maes Subject: Re: [scribes]: Teaching Calligraphy I teach far more calligraphy than illumination. The Moragh Method for learning is fairly similar to what you detailed. A student who has already done some calligraphy can start at which ever number s/he feels comfortable. 1. Learn how to sit, hold the pen and paper correctly. Teachers may need to learn how to write left-handed, if you have lefties as students. Otherwise, you won't be able to assist them as adequately. 2. Start with magic marker calligraphy pens. The student doesn't need to worry about how much ink they have in the pen, pressure on nibs, etc. They only need to work with letter formation. 3. Start with either Textura Quadrata ( 'gothic' ) or uncil. The quadrata (as opposed to the batard) really isn't that complicated. Both of these scripts provide easily seen examples of how pen with and angle effect the final product. They also allow for an easily seen effect of whether you are getting you line-line, letter-letter, or internal letter spacing correct. 4. Identify the different parts of the letters for the script you have chosen. Each script has a given set of strokes: which strokes are combined determines which letters you get. E.g. The right curve (as with an a) , left curve (as with a letter b), straight (as with a letter i or ascenders/descenders). 5. Practice the different strokes without making letters. 6. Start to put the letters together. 7. Start putting the letters together as words. 8. Replace the felt tip pen with a real pen. 9. I usually have them working a real pen after learning their first script to learn the details of pen control, serifs (which just don't really work with magic markers), pressure on the nib. You never stop learning. When I learn a new script, or a specific variant of one I know, this is the exact method I use for teaching myself something new. I would get really p-o'ed at a teach who just pulled my pen out of my hands. I see this as a gratuitous display of power left over from archaic teaching methods. I can tell from watching them write and watching the letters they are making whether or not they are pushing too hard. Their muscles tell them, as well, when they get writer's cramp after 5-10 words, rather than 5-10 lines. Calligraphy, like heavy weapons fighting (which I also teach, as my group's knight's marshal), should be ergonomic. If your muscles are complaining, it's probably because you're holding the pen too tightly. Just like when a fighter's hand wears out after 5 or 6 blows - s/he's holding the sword too tightly. Moragh inghean Eoghain Canton to be named at a later date Barony of Northwoods Midlrealm - ---wyverns wrote: > > I teach more illumination than calligraphy, but ... > > I recommend > > a) encourage the student to pick a simpler hand to start with (not > gothic) and work up to those that are more complex (i.e. require many > strokes for the most simple letters) > > b) have them practice l's and o's until they are tired of them or get > them consistantly right, whichever comes first. this gives them most of > the pieces they need - the straight strokes, the curves to the left, and > the curves to the right. > > --Then do m and (d or b or p), which gives them internal letter > proportions, horizontal extensions, and connections between curves and > lines > > --Then do any unique letters, such as the f/s's that have long trailers, > z's, h's with the curled tails, and such like letters > > --Then do capitols following the sequence all over again (although which > letters constitute 'straight strokes' and which letters constitute > 'curves' may be different) > > c) along the way or as a means of practice, get thin, cheap paper and > lay it over the top of a page of the text and have them follow along the > available letters to get a better feel for the stroke, spacing, and > sequencing of letters. > > d) some people find it complicates their lives, some people think it > helps: if one is trying to get a basic feel for a specific hand, I > recommend starting with a magic marker calligraphy pen, so that the > student don't have to think about ink flow and other issues. If the > focus is on learning how to handle a calligraphy pen, have the student > use a hand that they are already familiar with or just print modern > style so that they are focussing on grip and ink flow and such factors > and not having to worry about letter forms at the same time. > > e) i had a teacher tht came behind students and grabbed the en out of > their hand as they wrote - if there was a blurb because of it, then the > student was holding the pen too tight. I've also gotten good at > avaiding -oooppps- from bumped tables that way. As a teacher, I just > tell them that I -should- be able to take the pen away without > disturbing the ink on the paper, and I will (try to) pull it away when > they have lifted their pen from the paper. > > Hope this helps > --Enid > _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 11:34:32 PST From: "Ken Stoner" Subject: [scribes]: ARTWORK I have updated my personal page and have added links to my new artwork including the "little book" that Thomas Bromwell and I made two weeks ago. The URL is http://freya.elgar.com/cystenin.htm Cystennin Sends Kenneth Allen Stoner Elgar Corp (619)678-4414 Digital Eng. Dept - ------------------------------------------------------ Of course, things that *I* say do not reflect or imply the views of my employer. I.E. I think for myself. :) Pane' Sepullya ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 14:09:40 -0500 From: "Helen Schultz" Subject: Re: [scribes]: ARTWORK Cystennin, My server said "HTTP/1.0 404 OBJECT NOT FOUND. I even tried to do it with the "www" in front of the "freya." Perhaps your system was down when I tried it at about 2pm CDT? Meisterin Katarina Helene (KHvS) - ---------- Ken Stoner said: > I have updated my personal page and have added links to my new > artwork including the "little book" that Thomas Bromwell and I made > two weeks ago. The URL is > > http://freya.elgar.com/cystenin.htm > > Cystennin Sends > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:31:41 -0400 From: Michael Perry Subject: [scribes]: Master John Date: Sat, 16 May 1998 10:30:05 EDT From: FITCHYBEAR Subject: Re: [scribes]: Burnishing tools (was: Rubrication?? In a message dated 98-05-15 19:39:45 EDT, brownwell@home.com writes: << If any of you have an inside track to a leaf manufacturer, we (meaning I) would like gold at 0.55 grains per sheet, or 870 sheets per ounce, or 36 grams per 1000 sheets. Just in case... >> Master John the Artificer sells Cennini weight leaf at a reasonable price.....JimBear Greetings, Could you post contact information for Master John? Kenrick ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:15:28 -0700 From: Karen Williams Subject: RE: [scribes]: Teaching Calligraphy Catriona asks: >What is the best way to teach absolute beginners how to calligraph? I break down the hand into pieces. First I teach how to make the "o", since so many letters have that shape in them, then I teach the "l" (since "h", "b", etc. have that shape). Then I teach "n", and by that point they can pretty much do the whole alphabet. Branwen ferch Emrys ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 13:45:22 PST From: "Ken Stoner" Subject: [scribes]: Burnishing gold Greetings unto the list, My order of gesso from John Neal Bookseller came in last weekand I finally had the chance to sit down and play with it. Besides being dissapointed in the Quantity I recieved for 7$ (a dropp the size and weight of a quarter) I am somewhat happy with it. I tried laying it down and then burnishing the gesso directly with an agate dogs tooth. This worked VERY well. I then breathed on it and layed my gold down. This was not as easy. My *edges* are not as clean and crisp as I want. It seems difficult to get the gold to adhere all the way down to the paper on the edges. I then burnished the gold directly with my dogs tooth and WOW! Talk about mirror polish. Some observations: The smoother and neater you get gesso burnished, the easier it seems to get the gold to adhere and burnish. I have NEVER seen gold shine so well. WOW! Cystennin sends Kenneth Allen Stoner Elgar Corp (619)678-4414 Digital Eng. Dept - ------------------------------------------------------ Of course, things that *I* say do not reflect or imply the views of my employer. I.E. I think for myself. :) Pane' Sepullya ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 17:54:25 EDT From: FITCHYBEAR Subject: Re: [scribes]: Master John In a message dated 98-05-18 15:10:43 EDT, MPerry@ade.com writes: << Master John the Artificer sells Cennini weight leaf at a reasonable price.....JimBear Greetings, Could you post contact information for Master John? Kenrick >> master john's address is www.icubed.com/users/jrose/jartindx.html I believe that Balderic/Rick Cavasin has a link from his vellum website too......JimBear ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 17:50:55 -0500 From: Cornelius Perkins Subject: Re: [scribes]: Master John Michael Perry wrote: > Could you post contact information for Master John? Here's his web page: http://www.icubed.com/users/jrose/jartindx.html Cornelius - -- // Cornelius Perkins cperkins@nothinbut.net // http://www.nothinbut.net/~cperkins // In girum imus nocte et consumimur igni ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 May 1998 18:09:50 -0400 (EDT) From: randyaf@provide.net (Randy & Melody Asplund-Faith) Subject: Re: [scribes]: Burnishing gold Dear Cystennin, Wow that sounds pricy for what you get, especially considering what is in gesso. But I have got to ask, do you know what is in THIS gesso and what makes it work so well? I would be interested in a breakdown of its contents if you are lucky enough to have information on that. What the heck, value is subjective. If it gives you better gilding than you were getting before, thats great! Ranthulfr > Greetings unto the list, > > > My order of gesso from John Neal Bookseller came in last weekand I >finally had the chance to sit down and play with it. > > Besides being dissapointed in the Quantity I recieved for 7$ (a >dropp the size and weight of a quarter) I am somewhat happy with it. Randy Asplund-Faith 2101 S. Circle Dr. Ann Arbor, MI. 48103 (734) 663-0954 http://www.provide.net/~randyaf ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V2 #12 ****************************