From: owner-scribes@castle.org (scribes digest) To: scribes-digest@castle.org Subject: scribes digest V1 #89 Reply-To: Sender: owner-scribes@castle.org Errors-To: owner-scribes@castle.org Precedence: bulk scribes digest Thursday, February 26 1998 Volume 01 : Number 089 In this issue: [scribes]: Re: scribes digest V1 #73 -- Quills [scribes]: Gesso recipes [scribes]: Re: Gesso recipes ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 03:08:55 EST From: EowynA@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Re: scribes digest V1 #73 -- Quills In a message dated 2/25/98 1:25:12 AM, bhw@psychology.nottingham.ac.uk wrote: >iv) In period, quills (generally) did not have barbs. >v) So would most people in period recognise something with barbs as > a quill in period heraldry? >vi) Is a quill a period charge distinct from a feather? >vii) How was it drawn? Minor variation at the tip seems like too > subtle a difference. To answer these out of order, from the books on my shelf, > iv) In period, quills (generally) did not have barbs. See the rest of the discussion below. I agree that quill _pens_ in use did not have barbs, except perhaps a "flag" left at the tip. > vi) Is a quill a period charge distinct from a feather? -- yes. It is assumed to be wound with yarn, unless blazoned otherwise. The quill (a period form of embroidery bobbin not at all related to a feather) appears on the arms of the Worshipful Company of Broderers, registered 1558. >v) So would most people in period recognise something with barbs as > a quill in period heraldry? I am of two minds about this. Here are my two answers: 1 - I doubt it. A feather is a feather, and is usually drawn (as a distinct charge) as an ostrich feather (decidedly not a wing feather). Friar's _A Dictionary of Heraldry_ refers the "feathered " entry to attributes, as well as the "quilled" entry. The noun forms do not have separate entries. By the way, "feathered" refers to an arrow, "quilled" refers the quill of an ostrich feather. 2 - I suspect they would recognize a drawing of one of the wing primaries as a quill. Not a quill pen, but a quill (which really just means a wing feather ). In fact, looking up quill in the OED, the first meaning is "A hollow stem or stalk, as that of a reed", instances from 1412 +. The second definition is "a piece of reed or hollow stem on which yarn is wound; hence a bobbin, spool, or pirn of any kind", which usage dates from the 1400s. Third is a musical pipe from a hollow stem, then we get the curled bark of cinnamon, and it goes on. The third major division under quill finally identifies it with a feather. Later in the feather definition section it identifies a quill as "the feather of a large bird formed into a pen" (from 1550). So identifying a quill as a charge can mean a feather, but does not necessarily mean identifying it as a pen. vii) How was it drawn? Minor variation at the tip seems like too > subtle a difference. Here, I assume you actually mean a quill pen. I have never seen such as an heraldic charge, but last weekend at the Getty, I noted two paintings in particular that had the saints holding pens. In one, the pen was stripped of its barbs, the tip was cut and black with ink, and the size was reasonable for writing. In the second, the pen was stripped of its barbs, cut for writing, and was longer than the saint's arm. It was obviously meant to be seen and identified from afar as an Attribute (it was part of an alterpiece, after all). My conclusions from this cursory investigation: 1- "quill", as a charge in the Middle Ages, meant a yarn bobbin 2- "quill" also means a flight feather (i.e., with barbs). 3 - the only feathers I could find used as heraldic charges in our period were ostrich plumes (quite unsuitable for writing with) 4 - "quill pen" is needed to specify the writing implement. That was drawn in period (though I have no heraldic instances) as the barrel of a feather, naked of barbs. 5 - SCA College of Arms, as distinct from real-world (British -- my only sources near to hand) Colleges, registers "quills" as flight feathers with minor artistic details on the pointy end. We blazon "embroiderer's quill" to get the first definition, above. Does that help? :-> Eowyn Amberdrake, Caid (Clarion Queen of Arms Emeritus, currently Herald-at-Large in Caid) Melinda Sherbring, Los Angeles ------------------------------ Date: Wed, 25 Feb 1998 15:43:56 -0800 From: "Carolyn Richardson" Subject: [scribes]: Gesso recipes Does anyone out there have a good gesso recipe that doesn't involve white lead? I'm looking to try one out so the proportions needed are a must - I've seen several posts on various ingredients, but without the "pinch of this" details it's difficult to figure out how much to put in of stuff. Tetchubah of Greenlake Kingdom of Caid ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 26 Feb 1998 09:04:04 EST From: RenScribe@aol.com Subject: [scribes]: Re: Gesso recipes Here is the recipe given to me by Lady Talisidhe of the Greenwood GESSO 1 tsp. hide glue 2 tsp. water a touch of yellow ochre 6-12 drops of warm honey 1 TBL. slaked plaster She uses liquid hide glue, so if you use powdered you will have to mix some up first then measure the necessary amount. I have had some trouble finding hide glue at all and have tried this recipe substituting glair for it. (It's mentioned several times in _Materials and Techniques of Medieval Painting_ so I figured I'd give it a try. :-) It needs a few more drops of honey, but other than that seems to be as good as the original in application, adhesion of gold and finished appearance. I guess it will take a few years to see how it holds up over the long run. I have recently found liquid hide glue at our nearby Michaels craft store but have also seen it available through the mail from woodworking catalogs. You will probably have to play with the recipe a bit to fine tune it to your weather conditions. I always end up adding a lot more slaked plaster and I like to add a red color to it rather than yellow. Hope this helps Eibhlin ni Chaoimh AEthelmearc ------------------------------ End of scribes digest V1 #89 ****************************